Mark Adams on the changed landscape in college hoops

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SycamoreStateofMind

The Odum Level
Supporter
why would I not create a company right now to represent kids/parents in the negotiation process? Hire my company - we will handle your negotiations and take a % for our efforts?
 

CardLake49

The Starter Level
Supporter
Part 7 sums it all up. NCAA trying to keep their cash cow producing milk by any means necessary.

So what are we (ISU) gonna do about it? Are we getting out NIL $$ together to be able to compete with other Valley/mid major schools? I hope there is a plan in place in this regard. I'd also love to know what is a respectable annual NIL deal amount for the type of player that we get. Anyone have a guess?

We're gonna have to be able to sell the value of ISU hoops in other ways. Gonna have to be able to sell the long term value of being here vs the short term value of going somewhere else. Unfortunately it may take time to have something to point to.
 

dino

The Sycamore Level
Supporter
Nobody saw this coming. Nobody.
NCAA decided to open the door right before they were going to get dragged through the courts by several states who were already pushing NIL legislation. NCAA wanted the courts to set boundaries so they don’t have to. That’s really what they want. Not sure who starts legislating this first; states, federal, or NCAA rulings. A lot of money switching hands already but it was already happening. NCAA standing by their stance that athletes couldn’t get paid was not the “best” solution to the problems. Somebody has to set boundaries or we’ll just watch the market figure itself out.

my worst fear is not the money people will chase. I have a feeling you’ll see athletes getting harassed by the boosters when they aren’t performing as expected. When I say harassed I mean verbal or physical altercations between players and the dudes who feel like they “paid for their service.” Might sound like a slippery slope but rich people are going to be doing weird things. Imagine an investor throwing money at players and then gambling on that teams success. Imagine the fallout when a nut job starts taking his bad investments out on the players.

Athletes will need to be smart about the money they take and what the expectations are from them. Investors/boosters can’t be hunting them down trying to get cars and money back. I saw that it has already happened, if I believe everything I read on Twitter.
 

Jason Svoboda

The Bird Level
Administrator
NCAA decided to open the door right before they were going to get dragged through the courts by several states who were already pushing NIL legislation. NCAA wanted the courts to set boundaries so they don’t have to. That’s really what they want. Not sure who starts legislating this first; states, federal, or NCAA rulings. A lot of money switching hands already but it was already happening. NCAA standing by their stance that athletes couldn’t get paid was not the “best” solution to the problems. Somebody has to set boundaries or we’ll just watch the market figure itself out.

my worst fear is not the money people will chase. I have a feeling you’ll see athletes getting harassed by the boosters when they aren’t performing as expected. When I say harassed I mean verbal or physical altercations between players and the dudes who feel like they “paid for their service.” Might sound like a slippery slope but rich people are going to be doing weird things. Imagine an investor throwing money at players and then gambling on that teams success. Imagine the fallout when a nut job starts taking his bad investments out on the players.

Athletes will need to be smart about the money they take and what the expectations are from them. Investors/boosters can’t be hunting them down trying to get cars and money back. I saw that it has already happened, if I believe everything I read on Twitter.

Just wait for the tax evasion that will come out of this. Also the low income families that don't realize that those NLI deals now will prevent them from claiming their kid as a dependent on their taxes.
 

CardLake49

The Starter Level
Supporter
Just wait for the tax evasion that will come out of this. Also the low income families that don't realize that those NLI deals now will prevent them from claiming their kid as a dependent on their taxes.
I don't think folks will be so worried about losing a dependent if that dude brings home 50-100 racks.
 

CardLake49

The Starter Level
Supporter
Just wait for the tax evasion that will come out of this. Also the low income families that don't realize that those NLI deals now will prevent them from claiming their kid as a dependent on their taxes.
BTW do we have a sports accounting minor or certificate yet?
 

Jason Svoboda

The Bird Level
Administrator
I don't think folks will be so worried about losing a dependent if that dude brings home 50-100 racks.

You're expecting these kids to manage the money well.

So after they buy themselves a nice ride, work on their wardrobe, collect an army of tattoos and then blow it on other frivolous shit that 18-20 years spend on, suddenly they are in trouble. I also believe once you have a decent income, they will then also have to pay tax on their full cost of attendance items -- room and board, etc.

I don't see this going well unless the schools are now adding a personal finances adviser to their staff.
 

IndyTreeFan

The Nicks Level
Supporter
Two Three thoughts:

1) The move "Blue Chips" just became legal. Still gonna have the same problems for/with players and coaches as in that movie.
2) The non-P5 schools need to bite the bullet, leave the NCAA, and form a new association that is actually there to promote STUDENT-athletes. They'll need good lawyers to make sure their rules are legal, but they need to get back to players getting a free education and none of this other crap.
3) The "New Normal" SUCKS
 

CardLake49

The Starter Level
Supporter
You're expecting these kids to manage the money well.

So after they buy themselves a nice ride, work on their wardrobe, collect an army of tattoos and then blow it on other frivolous shit that 18-20 years spend on, suddenly they are in trouble. I also believe once you have a decent income, they will then also have to pay tax on their full cost of attendance items -- room and board, etc.

I don't see this going well unless the schools are now adding a personal finances adviser to their staff.
They vast majority won't manage it well, you're right for sure. I was actually alluding to something very stereotypical that I shouldn't have been and would've challenged if someone "else" did.
 

dino

The Sycamore Level
Supporter
You're expecting these kids to manage the money well.

So after they buy themselves a nice ride, work on their wardrobe, collect an army of tattoos and then blow it on other frivolous shit that 18-20 years spend on, suddenly they are in trouble. I also believe once you have a decent income, they will then also have to pay tax on their full cost of attendance items -- room and board, etc.

I don't see this going well unless the schools are now adding a personal finances adviser to their staff.
I’ve seen a few people take the stance that nobody should get paid because some of those players will be irresponsible. I don’t assume that’s exactly how you feel. I just know it’s not enough reason to prevent people from making money. I don’t care how my coworkers handle their finances but I could probably assume there a few who aren’t paying taxes, defaulting on loans, whatever. Best way to handle that as a coach and university is to provide athletes and their families with the all the information they need to make good decisions.
 

IndyTreeFan

The Nicks Level
Supporter
There is no way in a cold hell I would ever accept a position as a "personal finances advisor" for student athletes. You can advise these kids all you want to about how they should handle their money, but when they blow it all and the tax man cometh, don't think you won't get your ass sued into next week. And if/when it got to court, it would be all about the "poor child" that was not given good advice. I can see this one coming...
 

dino

The Sycamore Level
Supporter
There is no way in a cold hell I would ever accept a position as a "personal finances advisor" for student athletes. You can advise these kids all you want to about how they should handle their money, but when they blow it all and the tax man cometh, don't think you won't get your ass sued into next week. And if/when it got to court, it would be all about the "poor child" that was not given good advice. I can see this one coming...
Everything you fear can be squashed by smart people who will learn how to minimize risk in court. Properly worded contracts with all the right signatures can elimate most of the noise you fear. That’s why I personally think the only thing that truly ever gets legislated is what the players can get paid for and what they give in return. Investors/boosters will surely have lawyers writing contracts. “Setting proper expectations” is customer service 101. Whoever starts from there will likely be fine.
 

IndyTreeFan

The Nicks Level
Supporter
Everything you fear can be squashed by smart people who will learn how to minimize risk in court. Properly worded contracts with all the right signatures can elimate most of the noise you fear. That’s why I personally think the only thing that truly ever gets legislated is what the players can get paid for and what they give in return. Investors/boosters will surely have lawyers writing contracts. “Setting proper expectations” is customer service 101. Whoever starts from there will likely be fine.
In today's legal environment, the side who has the most effective lawyer will win. You can write the contract any way you want, but if one lawyer is particularly adept at painting the SA as a "poor, poor, pitiful child" who was taken advantage of, look out. "Setting proper expectations" means nothing when the people listening to them hear, and remember, only what they want to hear.

I get your point, but still, no way in a cold hell I'd jump on that train...
 

dino

The Sycamore Level
Supporter
In today's legal environment, the side who has the most effective lawyer will win. You can write the contract any way you want, but if one lawyer is particularly adept at painting the SA as a "poor, poor, pitiful child" who was taken advantage of, look out. "Setting proper expectations" means nothing when the people listening to them hear, and remember, only what they want to hear.

I get your point, but still, no way in a cold hell I'd jump on that train...
I don’t think I’d want to advise those people either.

When you walk into a hospital for service and have to sign all those notices… you are getting served what somebody has already deemed as “proper expectations.” Whoever writes those the best and upholds their part of the agreement reduces their liability to the smallest amount that they can. Contract language will matter the most. That’s a lesson everybody should learn. Educate the athletes and let stupid people be stupid people. NIL will never be elimantined just because some people won’t do it “right.”
 

Jason Svoboda

The Bird Level
Administrator
I’ve seen a few people take the stance that nobody should get paid because some of those players will be irresponsible. I don’t assume that’s exactly how you feel. I just know it’s not enough reason to prevent people from making money. I don’t care how my coworkers handle their finances but I could probably assume there a few who aren’t paying taxes, defaulting on loans, whatever. Best way to handle that as a coach and university is to provide athletes and their families with the all the information they need to make good decisions.

If you search "salary cap" here you can find the model I would have been okay with. If we want to turn college sports in a low level pro league, then put a salary cap in place so there is an equal playing field.
 
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