# Updated: SoE/SoB towers to come down



## SycamoreFan317

Will this really happen in my life time?

http://www.wthr.com/story/19593487/isu-to-demolish-twin-15-story-towers-next-year


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## bent20

Are they empty now? Are there immediate plans to construct something new on the site? I haven't been keeping up on this and the story is pretty short. Just curious if anyone knows.


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## IndianaState45

Yes the School of Education moved to University Hall. The Scool of Business to Federal Hall (The former Federal building at 7th and Cherry) Both were incredible renovations ... both now named. Bayh for Education. Scott for biz.


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## BankShot

Are they gonna wait until Homecoming? What an event...we should've torched those ugly concrete pillars back in the early 70's...what was it back then, just pour the concrete and not worry  about campus architectural heritage? Same thing happened @ HC...surely there was a starving Italian sculptor somewhere in Indiana?


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## Eleven

bent20 said:


> Are they empty now? Are there immediate plans to construct something new on the site? I haven't been keeping up on this and the story is pretty short. Just curious if anyone knows.



They are mostly empty now that Scott College of Business has moved to Federal Hall.

The original plan was to implode them, but I heard that the Eugene V. Debbs historical society was too worried about ground shaking, so they will have to be demo'd...  Originally, they planned to put the football stadium over that way... but that has changed now.  No big plans that I'm aware of.


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## Sycamore Proud

From the TribStar:

http://tribstar.com/news/x1052805983/ISU-towers-to-come-down-next-year


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## BankShot

Eleven said:


> They are mostly empty now that Scott College of Business has moved to Federal Hall.
> 
> The original plan was to implode them, but I heard that the *Eugene V. Debbs historical society was too worried about ground shaking*, so they will have to be demo'd...  Originally, they planned to put the football stadium over that way... but that has changed now.  No big plans that I'm aware of.



Why don't they move the Debs Home/Museum to Fairbanks Park to join Paul Dresser's memorial? Given their political backgrounds, they'd likely be good neighbors.


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## 4Q_iu

Eleven said:


> They are mostly empty now that Scott College of Business has moved to Federal Hall.
> 
> The original plan was to implode them, but I heard that the Eugene V. Debbs historical society was too worried about ground shaking, so they will have to be demo'd...  *Originally, they planned to put the football stadium over that way*... but that has changed now.  No big plans that I'm aware of.



Is there/would there be enough room to put a football stadium on the Statesmen Towers "footprint?"

Seems like it would be difficult to 'wedge' it in w/out a LOT of street re-routing and dirt movement


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## bent20

The stadium location is basically a done deal it would seem, so not much point in debating it now. I like the idea of it being on 3rd Street where people will see it as they drive into town.


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## Eleven

bent20 said:


> The stadium location is basically a done deal it would seem, so not much point in debating it now. I like the idea of it being on 3rd Street where people will see it as they drive into town.



It's absolutely going to be across US-41 now... but before the plans changed, the stadium was going to be on the east side of campus.. that's why they were buying up the houses in that neighborhood.


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## Bally #50

The oil wells are "alleged" to be near that side of campus, I think. Anyone else ever thought that if those wells took off and brought in a fortune, that the stadium might be one of the things on the "wish" list?


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## Jason Svoboda

Eleven said:


> It's absolutely going to be across US-41 now... but before the plans changed, the stadium was going to be on the east side of campus.. that's why they were buying up the houses in that neighborhood.


Aren't there still several business they would need to buy before anything could be done over there?


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## BankShot

bent20 said:


> The stadium location is basically a done deal it would seem, so not much point in debating it now. I like the idea of it being on 3rd Street where people will see it as they drive into town.



Plus, it opens a new campus developmental corridor which includes the Wabash River...something hard to buy! What's that so-called "river" that runs thru the IU campus...the Jordan?


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## landrus13

Where exactly is the new stadium gonna be?


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## 4Q_iu

jlandrus23 said:


> Where exactly is the new stadium gonna be?



http://irt2.indstate.edu/ir/assets/splan/Campus_Master_Plan.pdf

GO to pages 21 and 29 --- you'll see it


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## BrokerZ

I serve on a board at the Scott College of Business, and I heard this from a faculty member: one of the main reasons delaying the announcement of the plans to demolish the towers was a rare bird had made it's nest on the roof of one of the towers.  Some conservation society or state agency would not allow the demolision of the towers until the bird and it's nest could be safely relocated.  I'm not sure what kind of bird this was, but it was rare enough to halt any plans for the buildings.

I have no idea if the bird is still up there, but I'm guessing that situation has been taken care of.  Just thought it was an interesting story...


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## Sackalot

it was a falcon.
http://www.indstate.edu/news/news.php?newsid=3161


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## sycamore tuff

Sackalot said:


> it was a falcon.
> http://www.indstate.edu/news/news.php?newsid=3161



I think they relocated them to Atlanta Georgia around the beginning of August.


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## landrus13

4Q_iu said:


> http://irt2.indstate.edu/ir/assets/splan/Campus_Master_Plan.pdf
> 
> GO to pages 21 and 29 --- you'll see it



Thank you for posting that. And what buildings currently sit there?


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## GeoffreyK

Sounds like a good plan to me.  If they're not needed and they're costing money to just sit there unused, why keep them?


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## BankShot

Good to see a fresh new face here on Sycamore Pride! Spread the "gospel" among your ISU cohorts. Please excuse the inquiry, but what is a "Blumberg _Leaf Officer_?" Are you one of the 1st yr. founding members/dorm rep. of the ISU "Forest" Fan Club?


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## Sycamore Proud

Interesting editorial in today's TribStar:

http://tribstar.com/opinion/x325726615/EDITORIAL-Removing-towers-would-be-major-step-forward-for-ISU


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## BankShot

Do ya think it'll accelerate ISU's _exterior renovation_ of* Hulman Center*, which models the very same _sculptural VOID_ that Statesmen Towers reflected? Every time I visit HC, I always stop by the wonderful Clabber Girl grill for a treat, then look N at the BLAH entrance of HC. My God, they could've at least painted the damn thing!
I think the same people that poured the concrete of Markle Mill Dam in NTH (Otter Creek), poured  the concrete of HC.:violent:


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## Bob Evans

I think the notion that the towers are ugly is being overblown. They are not ugly to me. They are just huge powerful landmarks that make a part of the university visible from quite a distance. I have always liked those buildings. When I was at ISU in the 70's, we went upstairs and found a floor that looked like the hippies had just left. Psychedelic painted halls, etc. Could have been preserved as a museum for 60's college life or a movie set.


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## LoudNProud

Leaf officers are a type of leadership team incorporated through res life. I can't remember what the acronym stands for.


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## BankShot

Bob Evans said:


> I think the notion that the towers are ugly is being overblown. They are not ugly to me. They are just huge powerful landmarks that make a part of the university visible from quite a distance. I have always liked those buildings. When I was at ISU in the 70's, we went upstairs and found a floor that looked like the hippies had just left. Psychedelic painted halls, etc. Could have been preserved as a museum for 60's college life or a movie set.



That's the EXACT image that I have of the dorm...I had Sig Ep friend that lived there (Fairbanks Hall) in '70. The place was like a lil' Haight - Ashbury, with "high" #'s of East Coast student refugees...incense & MJ smells almost gagged me! My 1st & last trip to Statesmen Towers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haight-Ashbury


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## Bally #50

OK, I'll check in on the conversation. I also, do NOT think they are ugly. Some say Sycamore Towers are ugly too, but to be honest, the fact I could live in Rhoads as a FRESHMAN has a lot to do with why I came to ISU. They looked like fancy hotels to me. I dated many in the two halls at Statesmen where the ladies stayed. Charlie DeMaio and I met at Hendricks where he lived, when I was rushing him for my brotherhood. Because it was a long haul from Rhoads, I didn't visit much until I got a car on campus. (illegally). I've got a few bad memories from Statesmen as well but I will save those for another day (be thankful). Like most of us, we would love to see them imploded and we'll have to see if that ever happens. I seriously doubt that the Debs house has a real say in the matter as someone mentioned. I imagine, the buildings are just not on support beams like a normal building and that it will have to be taken down chunk by chunk. I will pay money to see the first chunk come down.


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## Sackalot

sorry guys, but the towers are horribly ugly!  I agree that the height brings with it ability to see them from a good distance and that will be missed.  But, for today's students and for the architecture of today's college campus they are outdated, ugly and unwelcoming and frankly they were when they were built.  Memories are memories and that I can't disagree with.  But the towers are and were terribly designed from an aesthetic viewpoint.  The use of concrete as the cornerstone of construction makes any building look like a parking garage.  Yet we have a parking garage on campus that is far better looking than the tower are....the institutional feel of these buildings and their location were ill conceived in the first place.  

You may have great memories..I have great memories of Sandison Hall-but that doesn't mean that the building itself wasn't ugly as heck!  It was ugly as heck but at least they painted it and made it look better.


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## Bally #50

I can show you dozens of campuses with dorms that were built during that time and MANY look like that. I am not apologizing for anyone because they are functionally disfunctional (as I often say) and left NO ROOM for improvement because of the way they were built but as far as dorms, they looked almost identical to Sycamore Towers room-wise and nobody ever complained about their look in those days because that is what dorms looked like. Ohio State has a dozen dorms that look as bad that were all built in the 60's. I am anxious to see them come down but I suppose it is what you are used to seeing that drives your opinions on the appearance of them.


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## Sackalot

I am not talking about the rooms.  The interior of a dorm is almost always the same (depending on the period in which they were built).  I am talking about the outside appearance.  They are ugly to me and most of the people I know.  If you can look at the towers and say, wow that is an attractive building...I don't know what you are looking at?


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## Bally #50

I know what you mean, Sack. I have said that I don't like them either, but it those days, MOST dorms looked boxy. That is all I am saying. I wouldn't expect you to like them but look around. Dorms from the 60's looked like that. They don't even build high-rise dorms anymore so they will never look like that again, either. In my four years, I never heard ONCE that Statesman was ugly. The times have changed, and thankfully for that!


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## ISU85

The towers coming down were even mentioned in a blurb in the "Milestones" section of the Fort Wayne Journal Gazette editorial page last weekend. I was shocked and pleased that anything ISU-related made it in the Fort Wayne media. It's a rarity.

http://www.jg.net/article/20120922/EDIT07/309229998/1147/EDIT07

As for the towers themselves, I too, kind of liked them. Not so much for their design but for the fact that it made the ISU campus feel larger than it is with towers anchoring each side of campus. Here's hoping they do something great with the land. That end of campus could use it.


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## BlueHeart

The Towers were preferred to living in Mary Stuart (Stewart...can't remember how to spell it) that was at the corner of 6th and Chestnut back in the day.  There was another house right next door to it, too.  When I was at ISU these two houses were classroom buildings.  I had a Health and Safety Class in the basement. It was a pre-requisite for Driver's Ed Endorsement on my Teaching License.  But they had been student housing at one point. Fun times...


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## BankShot

Knisely...East & West, caddy-cornered across from the ISU Bookstore. East is where the Social Science Ed Center (Dr. C.W. Engelland, Chair) was located before relocating in the building just E. of the Ballyhoo (late 70's). Actually, both were ideal spots for the "social sciences" to blossum!:cheers:

Or were you talking about 7th & Chestnut (SE corner)...I think that building was student housing, w/ the basement School of Nursing for awhile. 

Surprised they didn't mow those 6th & Chestnut buildings down when they enlarged the Gillum Hall parking lot. That area of campus was like the "Crossroads of ISU" back then...recall the traffic (pedestrian/car)?


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## SycamoreFan317

The on and off demolition is apparently off again, anybody in TH have the scoop on this.

http://www.wthr.com/story/24143595/2013/12/05/indiana-state-delays-demolishing-15-story-towers


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## BudDawgII

SycamoreFan317 said:


> The on and off demolition is apparently off again, anybody in TH have the scoop on this.
> 
> http://www.wthr.com/story/24143595/2013/12/05/indiana-state-delays-demolishing-15-story-towers



First oil wells on campus now housing projects!


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## BankShot

Article in the TH TribStar today...damn, I was hoping those UGLY ASS "concrete-only" things would be landfill across from Warn Field after X-mas. Remind me of the ISU Hulman Center south ticket office...anyone got some :blackeye: firecrackers left over from last Summer?


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## treeman

I don't know what they see in those buildings. but if this company does see them for a use it could work out very well for ISU. who knows how this one will turn out.


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## eagletree

I really wonder who this company is targeting as residents. I can not imagine students who are wanting to live in apartments choosing to live there. I sure hope this is not going to replace the proposed housing on Wabash. That would be much more beneficial to both the city and ISU. Never have heard if ISU has heard back from the state on that project.


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## ISU02

I don't think ISU would ever let a developer take over the Tower's and that developer allow non-student residents, but when money is changing hands, nothing's impossible.  Relatively speaking, I don't think the Statesman Towers are ugly either.  And loosing their impact on TH's sky line would be a greater loss than keeping them.  The Statesman Towers are unique relative to other campus structures, and provide greater diversity in architectural design. Although they aren't as magnificent as classically styled building, the towers capture a place in time. What they lack in Edwardian, Elizabethan, or Second Empire detail they make up in Speerian presence. Someone on here may know if we have dedicated athletic housing, like other universities have, but I think the towers(renovated in accommodating fashion) would lend themselves to recruiting efforts. Each floor could become some type of luxury suite.  I once saw the housing provided to University of Kentucky basketball players, and although the outside of the building was nondescript, the interior was luxurious.   With that said, I've been told by may father-in-law that one main reason that the towers are coming down is due to state funding formulas that require universities to maximize available space before additional funding request, and the towers(unused space) negatively effects that formula.


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## BankShot

"Architectural style?" LOL

Wish you'd been on our European History Study-Abroad  31/2 week tour in '74...you would've shit a gold brick or two if you think there's "architectural value" in that Statesman Towers trash. At the very best, it's "East Berlin Wallesque.":seestars:

The irony is that University officials didn't have a 2nd thought about destroying the old, on-campus 7th St. Terre Haute Train Terminal:

http://brisray.com/th/tpcards70.htm

Would've been a PERFECT fit for the Debs Museum, especially given Debs long association w/ the ARU during TH's historic reign as a midwest RR hub.


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## ISU02

Terre Haute has lost many beautiful buildings, but repeating the mistakes of the past by tearing things down without planning for the future is folly.  Once these high rise structures are gone the chances of ever seeing a high rise structure built on campus again is nil.  For me, they've always given the ISU campus and downtown TH a larger presence regardless of architecture style.  Repurposing them to make ISU more marketable to prospective students or athletes while maintaining the larger campus/city presence would be more beneficial than tearing them down and having nothing to show for.


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## bluestreak

BankShot said:


> "Architectural style?" LOL
> 
> Wish you'd been on our European History Study-Abroad  31/2 week tour in '74...you would've shit a gold brick or two if you think there's "architectural value" in that Statesman Towers trash. At the very best, it's "East Berlin Wallesque.":seestars:
> 
> The irony is that University officials didn't have a 2nd thought about destroying the old, on-campus 7th St. Terre Haute Train Terminal:
> 
> http://brisray.com/th/tpcards70.htm
> 
> Would've been a PERFECT fit for the Debs Museum, especially given Debs long association w/ the ARU during TH's historic reign as a midwest RR hub.



Just for the record, The main station was demolished in 1960, long before ISU had anything to do with it. Part of the building did remain standing for another 15 years or so, but it was primarily used by the U.S. P.S. Not at all sure that I.S.U. Had anything to do with the demolition, probably just bought a vacant lot.


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## GuardShock

BankShot said:


> "Architectural style?" LOL
> 
> Wish you'd been on our European History Study-Abroad  31/2 week tour in '74...you would've shit a gold brick or two if you think there's "architectural value" in that Statesman Towers trash. At the very best, it's "East Berlin Wallesque.":seestars:
> 
> The irony is that University officials didn't have a 2nd thought about destroying the old, on-campus 7th St. Terre Haute Train Terminal:
> 
> http://brisray.com/th/tpcards70.htm
> 
> Would've been a PERFECT fit for the Debs Museum, especially given Debs long association w/ the ARU during TH's historic reign as a midwest RR hub.



We're these two buildings on what is now ISU's property? They look like they would be roughly on 5th street but I am not 100% sure. I love that kind of history, thanks for posting that.


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## BudDawgII

GuardShock said:


> We're these two buildings on what is now ISU's property? They look like they would be roughly on 5th street but I am not 100% sure. I love that kind of history, thanks for posting that.



Don't even get me started on what the powers to be went and did to the ISU campus!  Ticks me off every time I come up there and remember the hub of activity at the Bookstore intersection and the whole flow of traffic--activity and yes even conversation on the campus.  Now its like a gig-saw puzzle with half the pieces missing.
So much for progress!


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## IndyTreeFan

BudDawgII said:


> Don't even get me started on what the powers to be went and did to the ISU campus!  Ticks me off every time I come up there and remember the hub of activity at the Bookstore intersection and the whole flow of traffic--activity and yes even conversation on the campus.  Now its like a gig-saw puzzle with half the pieces missing.
> So much for progress!



Oh come now.  You cannot possibly believe that the campus was better before the closing of the 6th and Chestnut intersection.  That's not what you're saying, right?


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## eagletree

Still think ISU needs to focus attention on possible housing on block between 5th and 6th on Wabash. It helps both ISU and downtown Terre Haute. I saw where the company was interested in the old ICON plant by the Wabash River. That might be a good athletic apartment  complex for football, soccer, and track athletes.


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## GuardShock

eagletree said:


> Still think ISU needs to focus attention on possible housing on block between 5th and 6th on Wabash. It helps both ISU and downtown Terre Haute. I saw where the company was interested in the old ICON plant by the Wabash River. That might be a good athletic apartment  complex for football, soccer, and track athletes.



You do know that they are already on a plan to do that right? The land has already been donated and they are deciding whether to demolish and rebuild or reuse what's already there.

And Mr. Buddawg, I have no clue where that train station was so please don't treat me like I'm stupid, I'm ignorant, there's a difference. I was just asking where the train station was located at.


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## BudDawgII

GuardShock said:


> You do know that they are already on a plan to do that right? The land has already been donated and they are deciding whether to demolish and rebuild or reuse what's already there.
> 
> And Mr. Buddawg, I have no clue where that train station was so please don't treat me like I'm stupid, I'm ignorant, there's a difference. I was just asking where the train station was located at.



I didn't say a damn thing about the train station. lol  Better do your homework before u start barking at this Tree!


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## BudDawgII

IndyTreeFan said:


> Oh come now.  You cannot possibly believe that the campus was better before the closing of the 6th and Chestnut intersection.  That's not what you're saying, right?



Yes ----that's exactly what I'm saying!  Now its like a ghost town!  No sense of energy or community /campus excitement!


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## GuardShock

I apologize as I do not know what you are talking about. You quoted me and then proceeded to talk badly about the campus. As a student I enjoy the campus and I have no issues with it.


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## BudDawgII

GuardShock said:


> I apologize as I do not know what you are talking about. You quoted me and then proceeded to talk badly about the campus. As a student I enjoy the campus and I have no issues with it.



No apology needed but please reread your thoughts.  You jumped me about a train station comment that I didn't even make.  I would never call or infer that someone is stupid on here.
I respect your opinion but was simply saying that IMO that there was a lot more energy, activity and communication on the way I remember it before the change.
Hope u have a good day and get your fellow students jacked up about coming to the games and supporting this team.


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## GuardShock

BudDawgII said:


> No apology needed but please reread your thoughts.  You jumped me about a train station comment that I didn't even make.  I would never call or infer that someone is stupid on here.
> I respect your opinion but was simply saying that IMO that there was a lot more energy, activity and communication on the way I remember it before the change.
> Hope u have a good day and get your fellow students jacked up about coming to the games and supporting this team.



While it is off topic, I would like to mention something as a commuter student. I DON'T HEAR A THING about anything sports related unless I reach out and make the effort to. Sure they put it in the statesmen but I don't know how many times I have talked to guys in the rec that knew nothing about the basketball or football games. They need to bombard our emails with things that say, "HEY THERE IS A GAME THIS FRIDAY AT HOME AND WE HAVE ONE HELL OF A TEAM! COME ON OUT!" Put advertisements around campus and in the rec and the commons that tell everyone when the next game is. The only time I have seen it mentioned is in the statemen and that's because I look for it. If they want better involvement from students, they have to put it infront of our face and say here it is. Let's be honest here and say that students don't come to ISU to root for the sports, they come here for an affordable education from a pretty good school. Well we can change that and Sycamorelynch is doing a great job. But there is so much more that can be done.


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## BankShot

bluestreak said:


> Just for the record, The main station was demolished in 1960, long before ISU had anything to do with it. Part of the building did remain standing for another 15 years or so, but it was primarily used by the U.S. P.S. Not at all sure that I.S.U. Had anything to do with the demolition, probably just bought a vacant lot.



To CORRECT "the record," the Union Station (9th St) was torn down in the 60's. The Big Four (7th St. - Photos I provided) wasn't demolished until the late 80's. They were two (2) DISTINCT rail stations! And yes, ISU owned the BIG FOUR when it was demolished.

This might help your memory:

http://specials.tribstar.com/Columns/Historical/2003/February23.html

1986 Demolition:

http://brisray.com/th/tpcards71.htm


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## IndyTreeFan

BudDawgII said:


> Yes ----that's exactly what I'm saying!  Now its like a ghost town!  No sense of energy or community /campus excitement!



Wow.  I'm not sure I've ever disagreed more with a post - ever.  But, you're entitled to your opinion.  I, personally, LOVE the campus!  It's a great place, far superior to what it was when I started.  No more worrying about getting hit!!!


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## BudDawgII

GuardShock said:


> While it is off topic, I would like to mention something as a commuter student. I DON'T HEAR A THING about anything sports related unless I reach out and make the effort to. Sure they put it in the statesmen but I don't know how many times I have talked to guys in the rec that knew nothing about the basketball or football games. They need to bombard our emails with things that say, "HEY THERE IS A GAME THIS FRIDAY AT HOME AND WE HAVE ONE HELL OF A TEAM! COME ON OUT!" Put advertisements around campus and in the rec and the commons that tell everyone when the next game is. The only time I have seen it mentioned is in the statemen and that's because I look for it. If they want better involvement from students, they have to put it infront of our face and say here it is. Let's be honest here and say that students don't come to ISU to root for the sports, they come here for an affordable education from a pretty good school. Well we can change that and Sycamorelynch is doing a great job. But there is so much more that can be done.



Now that is good information and stuff we need to know about and change!  If nothing changes---nothing changes!  Games have to be promoted and students have to be given incentives to get involved and have fun.  We see other Universities around the country that have figured this out and so can we!


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## BudDawgII

IndyTreeFan said:


> Wow.  I'm not sure I've ever disagreed more with a post - ever.  But, you're entitled to your opinion.  I, personally, LOVE the campus!  It's a great place, far superior to what it was when I started.  No more worrying about getting hit!!!



------glad your safe:hypnotized:


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## IndyTreeFan

BudDawgII said:


> ------glad your safe:hypnotized:



Thanks!  What a guy...:lol:


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## Eleven

BudDawgII said:


> Don't even get me started on what the powers to be went and did to the ISU campus!  Ticks me off every time I come up there and remember the hub of activity at the Bookstore intersection and the whole flow of traffic--activity and yes even conversation on the campus.  Now its like a gig-saw puzzle with half the pieces missing.
> So much for progress!


Wow, really??  You liked campus better with cargo trucks going through the intersection of 6th and Chestnut street?  Pedestrians were hit by traffic yearly at that intersection!!  It may be harder to drive THROUGH campus now - but that was the plan - and ISU is better for it....
That may be the first complaint that I have EVER heard about that intersection being closed...(from an ISU perspective)


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## BudDawgII

Eleven said:


> Wow, really??  You liked campus better with cargo trucks going through the intersection of 6th and Chestnut street?  Pedestrians were hit by traffic yearly at that intersection!!  It may be harder to drive THROUGH campus now - but that was the plan - and ISU is better for it....
> That may be the first complaint that I have EVER heard about that intersection being closed...(from an ISU perspective)



.....always nice to be a groundbreaker!:razz:  Never realized ISU was such a dangerous place back in the day!  Geez this younger generation!:smack:


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## Eleven

BudDawgII said:


> .....always nice to be a groundbreaker!:razz:  Never realized ISU was such a dangerous place but in the day!  Geez this younger generation!:smack:



Doubt that I'm that much younger...I spent many days dodging cars at that intersection while going to school here.
I seriously have never heard anyone complain about the lack of traffic there - it's a great place for students to gather now, with a great fountain in the middle of it.  One of the best places on campus...


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## BankShot

I think BudDawgII enjoyed that "hit or miss" activity...probably one of those guys camped out by the ISU 6th & Chestnut bookstore sidewalk railing between classes that majored in "Babe Scoping," which is the primary reason that those "cargo trucks" would cut thru Campus! Vehicles aren't blessed with this "scenic cruise" today. :razz:

I do recognize his point re: 6th & Chestnut being an ISU "campus crossroad" back in the dayz. The current Dede Plaza location is more off-center, weighted toward the western side of campus and NOT much of a "crossroad" by students between dorm & class. 

A big difference that I've noted in student commute patterns is the "closed social zone" created by personal I-Pod use.  It's as if students are afraid of making a NEW friend, prefering to "hide" in their own artificial world while in route to class. THIS PHENOMENA is a big difference from the 60's & 70's...and a possible factor in the "exchange of information" issue which Guardshock touches upon. 

I also note a significant (70%+) decline in student I-M participation by today's student as opposed to to 4 decades ago, which clearly must impact the "closeness" of the ISU Student Body. I-M's "back in the dayz" were PRIMARY TOOLS of ISU social programming among dorm residents and fraternity/sororities.


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## Sycamore Proud

BudDawgII said:


> .....always nice to be a groundbreaker!:razz:  Never realized ISU was such a dangerous place back in the day!  Geez this younger generation!:smack:



You really liked the configuration with the intersection of 6th and Chestnut?  Residence in Sandison Hall caused me to use that route far too much during my tenure at ISU.  Makes me wonder what you were smoking and/or drinking to have feelings like that.:lol:


----------



## Gotta Hav

Eleven said:


> Wow, really??  You liked campus better with cargo trucks going through the intersection of 6th and Chestnut street?  Pedestrians were hit by traffic yearly at that  a!!  It may be harder to drive THROUGH campus now - but that was the plan -
> That may be the first complaint that I have EVER heard about that intersection being closed...(from an ISU perspective)



Sounds like we got us a convoy Rubber Duck!

Cargo Trucks going through the intersection?  What in the world are you talking about?   I was on the 5.5 year plan....and I don't remember ever seeing a one cargo truck, 18 Wheeler, or Wide Load Truck at this intersection...ever.  Name the 300 companies, businesses or locations where those cargo trucks were coming from, and going to?  Okay, just name 30 ship from or ship to locations.....or better yet...do you have pictures, home movies, or youtube videos of this CrossRoads of America Cargo Truck traffic jam?   Surely you must have access to manifests or Bills of Lading to back up your statement.

And pedestrians hit....yeah...that's believable, if it happened in the last 10 years.  Gen X, Y, and Millennials all plugged in looking at smartphone screens, doing social media, with earbuds listening to their music....and not paying one second to their surroundings...yep that could happen, but we aren't talking about the last 10 years, are we?  That intersection has been closed, for how long?   If so many pedestrians were hit at this intersection...maybe you could provide some Campus Police metrics, or TH City Police data, or if was that bad.....surely Channel 10, or WTWO...or someone covered the pedestrian carnage at the old Bookstore corner.  

If you want to say that the campus is better for it. leave it at that, but don't make up a separate Universe, or Urban Legend....that didn't happen.


----------



## Sycamore Proud

Cargo trucks (box trucks) were sometimes on Chestnut making deliveries to FA, business and science buildings if I remember correctly.


----------



## Eleven

Delivery trucks went through there all the time... 

I probably COULD go back and find some examples of the incident reports if I cared enough to....but I KNOW what happened, and have no real desire to PROVE it to anyone.....if you are curious, you can research it yourself....or ask anyone that had been at public safety long enough.

It happened about every year.  I'm not talking about being run over, but there were reported incidents.


----------



## BankShot

Ya, I even recall "Batman" headed E. on Chestnut in a convertible on a Friday afternoon in front of the Bookstore during the Cunningham Library Dedication Day (Spring '73(?), fully caped and standing...waving to crowd of onlookers, then all of a sudden, *PRESTO*...the Bat Dawg opens his cape and is NUDE!  It was a virtual ISU CRAZY "parade" that day...ya, traffic was a real "hazard." 

We used to DREAM what campus would be like if these "traffic hazards" were routed around campus...now those DREAMS are a reality. 

Now back to the I-Pod ear bud techno "social networking" generation...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

They're so "connected"...:whiteflag:...and we're lucky to get 5% of 'em at an ISU Basketball game. Isn't Dede Plaza ACROSS THE STREET from the ISU Arena, where PE, REC & Health & Safety majors have classes? Where's the DISCONNECT?


----------



## BudDawgII

Wow some of you pups have sure lived sheltered lives if getting hit by a cargo truck at 6th and Chestnut was a major concern of yours while attending ISU!:freaked:  Recall that I was more interested in making eye contact with some lonely little coed---needing my assistance--than I was dodging "cargo" trucks!:nudgewink:
Wonder if any of you recall --the preacher guy--on 6th and Chestnut--that talked the "TRUTH" about the hedonistic life styles of guys like Bankshot and scantly clothed coeds---drugs and alcohol---premarital sex--homosexuality etc  Swear the guy was out there in front of the bookstore every day engaged in dialogue with students and professors!  Wonder if he was concerned about "cargo" trucks!!:freaked:  
Loved hanging out at that corner talking to fellow students--preacher man--professors-and yes those sexy ISU coeds!:yesfistpump:


----------



## Eleven

The preacher continues...still at the fountain...still calling the girls names, doing more harm than good in converting anyone...or showing any "love for one another"
Its all still there...minus the traffic..including any cargo trucks.


----------



## BankShot

BudDawgII said:


> ...
> Wonder if any of you recall --the preacher guy--on 6th and Chestnut--that talked the "TRUTH" about the hedonistic life styles of guys like Bankshot and scantly clothed coeds---drugs and alcohol---premarital sex--homosexuality etc....


:angel:
Well, the "seed" was planted, but only receiving Bush/Lil' Kings nutritional supplements during the ISU yearz...I blame "peer influence" for these vices!


----------



## Gotta Hav

Eleven said:


> Delivery trucks went through there all the time...
> 
> I probably COULD go back and find some examples of the incident reports if I cared enough to....but I KNOW what happened, and have no real desire to PROVE it to anyone.....if you are curious, you can research it yourself....or ask anyone that had been at public safety long enough.
> 
> It happened about every year.  I'm noth talking about being run over, but there were reported incidents.



Oh no, not a delivery truck....hey, I'm not curious about anything, and i'm not researching nothing.  I'm not the one that made the unsubstantiated statement.

...you're just the first person, that ever heard hyperbolize how detrimental this simple and non-complex intersection was to the Public Welfare, and General Safety of the public.

I was there too....and I don't remember anything about once-a-year incident, of a pedestrian being clipped.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

I almost got hit numerous times on 4th and 5th streets going to Wolf Field, crossing from the Arena to HMSU, etc.


----------



## BudDawgII

The only "cargo" trucks I remember were the "Budweiser Trucks" keeping Bally's supplied with fresh brew!  I never considered them a threat!!:laugh:


----------



## BankShot

Gotta Hav said:


> Oh no, not a delivery truck....hey, I'm not curious about anything, and i'm not researching nothing.  I'm not the one that made the unsubstantiated statement.
> 
> ...you're just the first person that ever heard hyperbolize how detrimental this simple and non-complex this intersection was to the Public Welfare, and General Safety of the public.
> 
> I was there too....and I don't remember anything about once-a-year incident, of a pedestrian being clipped.



The biggest threat @ 6th & Chestnut I ever saw was when RICHARD LUGAR was campaigning for U.S. Senate (1970?) while Mayor of 'Nap. I shook his hand, but couldn't tell if he was smiling:smile: or simply grimacing from hemorrhoids.:disturbed:


----------



## nwi stater

Hold your horses.......................

According to the news up here in da region....... A group wants to buy them for affordable housing complex. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


----------



## Sackalot

nwi stater said:


> Hold your horses.......................
> 
> According to the news up here in da region....... A group wants to buy them for affordable housing complex. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm



Well that sounds like a horrible idea!!!  They are falling apart and they are sinking.  It would take millions upon millions to renovate it to livable standards (HVAC, structural, not to mention parking and several other issues).  This was a dorm, which means it was designed to house students 2 per room.  Those rooms are pretty much still there (all faculty offices were still the size of a dorm room), department offices were larger, but still.  Its going to take (IHMO which is no expert) 10-12 million to renovate each tower.  With that in mind, my guess 25-30 million for the entire project.  Why not just build something new for that?  And build it in a better location than literally on campus....developer may want to look at it, but the are quickly going to find out that they can't make any money off of it.


----------



## Gotta Hav

Jason Svoboda said:


> I almost got hit numerous times on 4th and 5th streets going to Wolf Field, crossing from the Arena to HMSU, etc.



Hey, being a Under-the-Influence as a Kappa Alpha pledge, does not count as being ALMOST hit, numerous times.  

Did I ever tell you that I almost won the Hoosier Lottery?  Yeah. True story.  I was off by one numerical up or down number, by just one digit.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Gotta Hav said:


> Hey, being a Under-the-Influence as a Kappa Alpha pledge, does not count as being ALMOST hit, numerous times.
> 
> Did I ever tell you that I almost won the Hoosier Lottery?  Yeah. True story.  I was off by one numerical up or down number, by just one digit.



Nah, I was only under the influence on campus maybe one or twice. People used to FLY down 4th and 5th streets. I can only imagine how bad drivers on campus are today with additional distractions -- texting wasn't popular until well after I left school.


----------



## BankShot

Jason Svoboda said:


> Nah, I was only under the influence on campus maybe one or twice. People used to FLY down 4th and 5th streets. I can only imagine how bad drivers on campus are today with additional distractions -- texting wasn't popular until well after I left school.



We called it "chesting" & "skirting" back in the dayz...


----------



## sycamore tuff

Sackalot said:


> Well that sounds like a horrible idea!!!  They are falling apart and they are sinking.  It would take millions upon millions to renovate it to livable standards (HVAC, structural, not to mention parking and several other issues).  This was a dorm, which means it was designed to house students 2 per room.  Those rooms are pretty much still there (all faculty offices were still the size of a dorm room), department offices were larger, but still.  Its going to take (IHMO which is no expert) 10-12 million to renovate each tower.  With that in mind, my guess 25-30 million for the entire project.  Why not just build something new for that?  And build it in a better location than literally on campus....developer may want to look at it, but the are quickly going to find out that they can't make any money off of it.



You are absolutely correct.  Affordable housing is a terrible idea.  I say we tear them down and build new buildings  that are not affordable.  Affordable is not the way to go.


----------



## BankShot

I think they should make a resort out of it...collaborate w/ the Vigo & TH Chamber of Commerce and build a wave pool on the top...also have a "Ballyhoo Interpretive Center" w/ viewing telescopes (nightvision) to observe night skirmishes, rumble activity, gun fights, etc. Turner Coach Lines could bring tourists from Gary & Indpls to spend mini-vacations in TH enjoying suds & surf.


----------



## Pacercolt99

Well you know, this would not be the first time a rare Bird landed at ISU.  The first one was named Larry !


----------



## BankShot

Pacercolt99 said:


> Well you know, this would not be the first time a rare Bird landed at ISU.  The first one was named Larry !



You need to visit Hulman Airport during seasonal bird migration and check the plane propellers...there's a # of "birds" that visit, you just don't hear about 'em!:shocked2:


----------



## Jason Svoboda

The last company interested in buying them apparently fell through. They were the group that bought the old Indianapolis Indians stadium and converted it into housing. If anyone is interested in seeing how those turned out, link is below.

http://www.coreredevelopment.com/apartments/stadium-lofts/

Demolishing them is going to cost $4m.


----------



## 4Q_iu

Jason Svoboda said:


> The last company interested in buying them apparently fell through. They were the group that bought the old Indianapolis Indians stadium and converted it into housing. If anyone is interested in seeing how those turned out, link is below.
> 
> http://www.coreredevelopment.com/apartments/stadium-lofts/
> 
> Demolishing them is going to cost $4m.




Interesting --- I'd heard that there was a plan to "repurpose them"...   $4M to knock down; probably not out of the realm; even imploding them and carting off the debris is a helluva big job.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Though I would have liked to see someone (other than ISU) be able to refurbish those buildings and make them into something useful I think this is the best decision for Indiana State. 

Sometimes it's better just to demo and move on, if you disagree see the Terre Haute House. Although the towers are likely less iconic sometimes it's just better to do away with the old and make plans for the new. 

ISU has done a good job of putting money into buildings that can still be useful and this is just not one of them.


----------



## sycamore tuff

If ISU was a company spending their own money I doubt they would be tearing down existing dorms (because of asthetics) and building new ones.  They are great at spending someone elses money.  I'm not picking on ISU.  It's just the way all of government does things.


----------



## GuardShock

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> Though I would have liked to see someone (other than ISU) be able to refurbish those buildings and make them into something useful I think this is the best decision for Indiana State.
> 
> Sometimes it's better just to demo and move on, if you disagree see the Terre Haute House. Although the towers are likely less iconic sometimes it's just better to do away with the old and make plans for the new.
> 
> ISU has done a good job of putting money into buildings that can still be useful and this is just not one of them.



I agree with SSOM on this one. I got to live in Pickerl right after they renovated it for the fall of 2011. Talk about a FANTASTIC dorm. And the fact that it was coed made it a little better :lol:. But really though, they did a fantastic job and ISU has really made some strides to make the campus better for students. I wish they would have renovated these buildings but maybe they'll put something better there? Maybe a little more parking, that would be nice.


----------



## 4Q_iu

sycamore tuff said:


> If ISU was a company spending their own money I doubt they would be tearing down existing dorms (because of asthetics) and building new ones.  They are great at spending someone elses money.  I'm not picking on ISU.  It's just the way all of government does things.



For the record, there are a HELLUVA lot of Private Companies that spend TAXPAYER money.   As a public university, ISU can / will spend all types (Fed Tax, State Tax, Endowment returns AND the annual fund).


----------



## BrokerZ

Are students still living in those buildings now?  If I recall there were 12 floors that had 40 rooms each, holding two per room.  That's 3,840 students living in those buildings.  Where are they all going to go, or where have they all already gone if they aren't being used?

As a "Cromwell 10" native, I'm curious.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

BrokerZ said:


> Are students still living in those buildings now?  If I recall there were 12 floors that had 40 rooms each, holding two per room.  That's 3,840 students living in those buildings.  Where are they all going to go, or where have they all already gone if they aren't being used?
> 
> As a "Cromwell 10" native, I'm curious.



Huh? The SoE/SoB haven't had students since the 70s or before I think.

All of the existing campus dorms have been refurbished or will be in the near future.


----------



## IndyTreeFan

There is some confusion as to what the "STATESMAN TOWERS" actually are.  Cromwell, Rhodes, Blumberg and Mills are the "SYCAMORE TOWERS."  They are different.  School of Business and School of Education used to be in Statesman Towers.

Just a bit of confusion that I hope I didn't make worse...:blink:


----------



## Bally #50

Believe it or not, there haven't been students in Statesman since 1977-78. Hard to believe that the buildings, built in 1967 were considered not needed in only 10 years. The schools of Ed and Business had been there essentially from 1979 to 2009. The dorms were basically built with poured concrete, which was said to be cost-saving and forward-thinking at the time but of course, that method made changes to the buildings practically impossible. AC could never be added because of the amount of cutting thru cement it would take to accomplish it. Window air conditioners meant that the cost of electricity was much higher and wasteful to boot. 

Unfortunately, much of the blame lies with my old buddy, Dr. Rankin and his Board of Trustees. Even the money earmarked by the state legislature has been affected for years by the huge amount of "assets" not being utilized making our percentage of assets to liabilities off-balanced. ISU has advertised that they had two building suitable for imploding to Hollywood for a movie in hopes of getting it done for free but obviously, they have had no takers to this point.

In no way could I have known all these dates. I will give credit to the Indiana State website for giving me the facts! Certainly, Statesman Towers are probably symbolic of one of the all-times boondoggles of waste in all of higher education.


----------



## 4Q_iu

Bally #47 said:


> Believe it or not, there haven't been students in Statesman since 1977-78. Hard to believe that the buildings, built in 1967 were considered not needed in only 10 years. The schools of Ed and Business had been there essentially from 1979 to 2009. The dorms were basically built with poured concrete, which was said to be cost-saving and forward-thinking at the time but of course, that method made changes to the buildings practically impossible. AC could never be added because of the amount of cutting thru cement it would take to accomplish it. Window air conditioners meant that the cost of electricity was much higher and wasteful to boot.
> 
> Unfortunately, much of the blame lies with my old buddy, Dr. Rankin and his Board of Trustees. Even the money earmarked by the state legislature has been affected for years by the huge amount of "assets" not being utilized making our percentage of assets to liabilities off-balanced. ISU has advertised that they had two building suitable for imploding to Hollywood for a movie in hopes of getting it done for free but obviously, they have had no takers to this point.
> 
> In no way could I have known all these dates. I will give credit to the Indiana State website for giving me the facts! Certainly, Statesman Towers are probably symbolic of one of the all-times boondoggles of waste in all of higher education.



Everyone should read the following timeline:

 -- ISU_Evansville Campus founded / created / etc* in 1965*

 -- Statesmen Towers built on ISU main campus *in 1967* (Viet Nam war still expanding)

 -- In 1968, Dr. Maynard K. Hine, dean of the IU School of Dentistry, began working with then Indpls Mayor Richard Lugar, IU President Joseph L. Sutton, Purdue President Frederick L. Hovde and other community leaders *to establish IUPUI in 1969 *through the merger of the Indianapolis extension programs of both IU and Purdue. Some schools, however, were established before the merger including the IU School of Medicine, IU School of Dentistry, IU Robert H. McKinney School of Law, IU School of Liberal Arts and IU Herron School of Art.

I would say the folks guilty of this "boondoggle" are NOT just ISU folks BUT the folks at IU, Purdue, the Statehouse.

After Viet Nam ended (and the draft ended), how quickly did ISU's enrollment DROP?  A lot!  Why?  No war, no draft, no NEED to be a Student in order to acquire a Student deferment.


----------



## Bally #50

4Q_iu said:


> Everyone should read the following timeline:
> 
> -- ISU_Evansville Campus founded / created / etc* in 1965*
> 
> -- Statesmen Towers built on ISU main campus *in 1967* (Viet Nam war still expanding)
> 
> -- In 1968, Dr. Maynard K. Hine, dean of the IU School of Dentistry, began working with then Indpls Mayor Richard Lugar, IU President Joseph L. Sutton, Purdue President Frederick L. Hovde and other community leaders *to establish IUPUI in 1969 *through the merger of the Indianapolis extension programs of both IU and Purdue. Some schools, however, were established before the merger including the IU School of Medicine, IU School of Dentistry, IU Robert H. McKinney School of Law, IU School of Liberal Arts and IU Herron School of Art.
> 
> I would say the folks guilty of this "boondoggle" are NOT just ISU folks BUT the folks at IU, Purdue, the Statehouse.
> 
> After Viet Nam ended (and the draft ended), how quickly did ISU's enrollment DROP?  A lot!  Why?  No war, no draft, no NEED to be a Student in order to acquire a Student deferment.



No argument there, 4Q. I also know that following my graduation in 71, the next two classes were the biggest ever (and the ones that are slightly larger than this fall's class) but still-- whoever is to blame, it was the kind of error than has affected the school for 4+ decades. By the way, I forgot to mention that I also would have loved to see them redone to accommodate them for student housing (I had heard that they were trying to build low-cost housing) because there is a huge shortage of rental property that is affordable on/near campus.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Well that CORE group would definitely not have been that. Pat was paying a King's ransom to live in those other apartments. 

I was told that they, aside from the issues you mentioned, were slowly sinking into the ground. Had you heard that?


----------



## Bally #50

Jason Svoboda said:


> Well that CORE group would definitely not have been that. Pat was paying a King's ransom to live in those other apartments.
> 
> I was told that they, aside from the issues you mentioned, were slowly sinking into the ground. Had you heard that?


Yes I have. Being ALL concrete, they must weigh twice as much as a normal building.


----------



## 4Q_iu

Bally #47 said:


> No argument there, 4Q. I also know that following my graduation in 71, the next two classes were the biggest ever (and the ones that are slightly larger than this fall's class) but still-- whoever is to blame, it was the kind of error than has affected the school for 4+ decades. By the way, I forgot to mention that I also would have loved to see them redone to accommodate them for student housing (I had heard that they were trying to build low-cost housing) because there is a huge shortage of rental property that is affordable on/near campus.



No suprise your class of 1971 (entered no earlier than 1967 correct?) was large and the classes of '72 and '73 were even larger.  Those classes would have STARTED college at the HEIGHT of the Viet Nam war.

I put MOST of the blame on the State believing there was a NEED for a residential, 4-year school in Indianapolis.   I'd start with Govs Matt Welsh (1961-65), Roger Branigan (1965-1969) and Ed Whitcomb (1969-1973) as part of the problem... at that point, the state had 4 residential, 4-yr campuses; seriously doubt there was a need for ISU_E, IUPUI and now IPFW.

Is there a housing shortage in T-H?   Do those folks WANT to live in a high rise?   I know the 'subsidized' housing center on Wabash?  Cherry?   The Deming Center was recently shuttered and the residents "re-settled"...

But if there's no need OR if the cost to re-purpose them is too great for State (and I don't see a Pence Administration stepping up...)   WHAT is Dr Bradley and the rest supposed to do?


----------



## BrokerZ

Jason Svoboda said:


> Huh? The SoE/SoB haven't had students since the 70s or before I think.
> 
> All of the existing campus dorms have been refurbished or will be in the near future.



Um, yeah, my bad.  I was getting teh Sycamore Towers and the Statesman Towers confused.  Carry on.  Nothing to see here.


----------



## Bally #50

4Q_iu said:


> No suprise your class of 1971 (entered no earlier than 1967 correct?) was large and the classes of '72 and '73 were even larger.  Those classes would have STARTED college at the HEIGHT of the Viet Nam war.
> 
> I put MOST of the blame on the State believing there was a NEED for a residential, 4-year school in Indianapolis.   I'd start with Govs Matt Welsh (1961-65), Roger Branigan (1965-1969) and Ed Whitcomb (1969-1973) as part of the problem... at that point, the state had 4 residential, 4-yr campuses; seriously doubt there was a need for ISU_E, IUPUI and now IPFW.
> 
> Is there a housing shortage in T-H?   Do those folks WANT to live in a high rise?   I know the 'subsidized' housing center on Wabash?  Cherry?   The Deming Center was recently shuttered and the residents "re-settled"...
> 
> But if there's no need OR if the cost to re-purpose them is too great for State (and I don't see a Pence Administration stepping up...)   WHAT is Dr Bradley and the rest supposed to do?



Note that the Demming is to be renovated in the next 5 years or so I think, by the same company that chose to pass on the Statesman Towers. One thing I have learned in an investigation of the cost of housing for ISU students (to get options of our fraternity undergrads), I have discovered that costs that once were once $1600 per semester are now 5-6 times more in less than a decade. The university has priced their housing above what it cost to live on campus at Purdue or IU. That's ridiculous! That increased cost has directly caused students on a budget to leave university housing and seek to rent and to larger apartments that could accommodate more beds. Because of it, the demand for off-campus has raised prices there as well. It's a cluster f**k.   

Dr. Bradley is smart enough to know that student housing may be his greatest issue for ISU in the decade to come or so. If they are to grow to 16-18K in the next five years, I read on here that someone said they can handle those numbers. I'd love to see how they can handle that with what is either available or to be renovated, a la the Demming, or private owned proposed fraternity village at 3rd and Locust.


----------



## Superfan1

Surely they could have figured a way to build the sorority housing in these two buildings or at least on of them instead of taking away that pay lot putting up a brand new building.


----------



## Bally #50

Superfan1 said:


> Surely they could have figured a way to build the sorority housing in these two buildings or at least on of them instead of taking away that pay lot putting up a brand new building.



See above. It has been determined that it is IMPOSSIBLE to reconfigure those buildings due to the unusual method of construction. The sororities already are living in a brand-new hall, Reeve Hall behind the Rec Center.


----------



## bluestreak

Its a little difficult for me to be critical of the current ISU administration for mistakes made 50 years ago. The campus and the social climate was radically different back then. If you want see some crumbling 60's monstrosities, check out the Northern Illinois University dorms. Scary.


----------



## 4Q_iu

Bally #47 said:


> See above. It has been determined that it is IMPOSSIBLE to reconfigure those buildings due to the unusual method of construction. The sororities already are living in a brand-new hall, Reeve Hall behind the Rec Center.



Isn't Reeve Hall open to ALL female ISU students?  It's merely catering to the sororities?   As to any fraternity village, it SHOULD be/MUST be privately funded.  Zero reason for a public university build fraternity houses.


----------



## Bally #50

4Q_iu said:


> Isn't Reeve Hall open to ALL female ISU students?  It's merely catering to the sororities?   As to any fraternity village, it SHOULD be/MUST be privately funded.  Zero reason for a public university build fraternity houses.



4Q, I am not sure about Reeve being all or part sorority but it is my understanding that it is all sorority and the it is owned by ISU. The arrangement of the new Reeve Hall is similar to what Lincoln Quad has been with sororities since it was built but I can tell you that the sororities are paying dearly to live in Reeve. It's beautiful but it is NOT cheap. What they are talking about at 3rd and Locust would likely be fraternities AND students, again similar to the arrangements at Lincoln but privately funded and operated with the fraternities having an option to pay for upgrades to the exteriors. It is not building "houses," just suites like Lincoln.


----------



## Bluethunder

Update

http://www.tribstar.com/news/local_...cle_8081b470-a1f9-5b25-ae31-a9edd822a4f1.html


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Does anyone else find it a complete joke that they are spending money to take down these two towers but yet they have no plans for the ICON Dump Ass Looking Building that sits right next to the new Track and Field facility? You would think that they would want to demo that dump of a building before they demo 2 buildings that they might actually have a use for eventually. 

I think I agree with them that these 2 towers needed to come down but I don't think they should have come down before that ICON Building.


----------



## IndyTreeFan

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> Does anyone else find it a complete joke that they are spending money to take down these two towers but yet they have no plans for the ICON Dump Ass Looking Building that sits right next to the new Track and Field facility? You would think that they would want to demo that dump of a building before they demo 2 buildings that they might actually have a use for eventually.
> 
> I think I agree with them that these 2 towers needed to come down but I don't think they should have come down before that ICON Building.



I thought the company that was rehabbing the Deming Center was going to rehab the ICON building into loft apartments?


----------



## Jason Svoboda

I don't think that land is currently earmarked for anything but more parking, is it? I just can't believe these couldn't have been repurposed in some way until that land was needed for new buildings. 

Yes, they're ugly. Yes, they were always hot or cold as shit, but I thought they were poured concrete and very solid structures?


----------



## Jason Svoboda

IndyTreeFan said:


> I thought the company that was rehabbing the Deming Center was going to rehab the ICON building into loft apartments?



I thought it was deemed not feasible?

Does ISU own the ugly, rusted looking building at the corner of 3rd/Lafayette? That thing is also a giant eyesore.


----------



## 4Q_iu

I've heard that the Statesmen Towers were impossible to re-hab for two reasons.

1) As they were poured concrete, it was virtually impossible to knock down interior walls and reconfigure the space and

2)  They were considered "great examples of the Brutalist style of architecture..."  as such, different groups could make it difficult to reconfigure as something
other than original intent (dorms)

Be glad we're RID of them!

Next, the ICON building


----------



## sycamore tuff

4Q_iu said:


> I've heard that the Statesmen Towers were impossible to re-hab for two reasons.
> 
> 1) As they were poured concrete, it was virtually impossible to knock down interior walls and reconfigure the space and
> 
> 2)  They were considered "great examples of the Brutalist style of architecture..."  as such, different groups could make it difficult to reconfigure as something
> other than original intent (dorms)
> 
> Be glad we're RID of them!
> 
> Next, the ICON building



1)  It may be virtually impossible but in real life I'm sure where there is a will there is a way.  I think Will is MIA.

2)  Original intent (dorms).  ISU sure doesn't need any of those do they?  Most people are more fiscally responsible when they are spending their own money.


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## 4Q_iu

sycamore tuff said:


> 1)  It may be virtually impossible but in real life I'm sure where there is a will there is a way.  I think Will is MIA.
> 
> 2)  Original intent (dorms).  ISU sure doesn't need any of those do they?  Most people are more fiscally responsible when they are spending their own money.



Apparently, Dr Bradley, the ISU Board of Trustees and the Government of Indiana disagree with you.  IF the dorms could have easily/CHEAPLY been re-configured (move interior rooms around...) - I'm sure they Towers would remain.  However, as they contain asbestos, cannot be easily reconfigured; it was decided to raze them.

Dr Bradley has 2 hard science degrees and 2 engineering degrees -- if HE was comfortabel knocking these eyesores down, I support him.

You DO realize that we are KEEPING, Re-habbing Normal Hall, right? 

http://statemagazine.com/nothing-normal-about-this-renovation/
http://arcdesign.us/projects/indiana-state-university-normal-hall-–-feasibility-study/
http://statemagazine.com/tag/normal-hall/

If you have a problem with razing the Towers, you can reach Dr Bradley at this number: 812-237-4000 and this e-mail: president@indstate.edu


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## treeman

Well ladies and gents....my friend (who is a current student) just sent me a video of a wrecking ball hitting the top of one of the towers....its finally happening


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## Daveinth




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## sycamore tuff

Sad day in Indiana Taxpayer history.


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## TreeTop

http://wthitv.com/2015/04/13/demoli...towers-estimated-to-take-four-to-five-months/

An implosion would be way more expensive than a four to five month wrecking ball process?


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## Jason Svoboda

Quabachi said:


> http://wthitv.com/2015/04/13/demoli...towers-estimated-to-take-four-to-five-months/
> 
> An implosion would be way more expensive than a four to five month wrecking ball process?



Environmental concerns I'd imagine?


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## Southgrad07

Unless they have some other plan for parking why on earth would they be using that huge area for "green space" when they desperately need parking.


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## 4Q_iu

sycamore tuff said:


> Sad day in Indiana Taxpayer history.



Really??  Show me the rivers of tears?


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## 4Q_iu

Jason Svoboda said:


> Environmental concerns I'd imagine?




correct --- an implosion would create a helluva lot of concrete dust;  if it were a really rainy day; some/most of it would be suppressed.

the other reason for a wreaking ball --- the Eugene V. Debs House sits "next door" to the Towers;  I've heard they've been quite concerned about "living in the middle of a construction/demolition zone."

The important thing --- we're razing two unneeded, unattractive buildings.

As to green space...   I'm not convinced parking is such a DESPERATE issue.   If there's one thing an urban campus like State can use... MORE GREEN SPACE

IF (and that's a HELLUVA big if) parking is such a HUGE issue; ban cars for FROSH.


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## GuardShock

4Q_iu said:


> correct --- an implosion would create a helluva lot of concrete dust;  if it were a really rainy day; some/most of it would be suppressed.
> 
> the other reason for a wreaking ball --- the Eugene V. Debs House sits "next door" to the Towers;  I've heard they've been quite concerned about "living in the middle of a construction/demolition zone."
> 
> The important thing --- we're razing two unneeded, unattractive buildings.
> 
> As to green space...   I'm not convinced parking is such a DESPERATE issue.   If there's one thing an urban campus like State can use... MORE GREEN SPACE
> 
> IF (and that's a HELLUVA big if) parking is such a HUGE issue; ban cars for FROSH.



As a student... We need more parking. If you have a 9:00 class and live off campus. Good luck finding a spot if you're running late without parking in the very far corner of the old COB/COE parking lots. I have issues with the new campus apartments in down town too.. Where are they gonna park? This past year they had to be close to maximum capacity for cars parked.


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## 4Q_iu

GuardShock said:


> As a student... We need more parking. If you have a 9:00 class and live off campus. Good luck finding a spot if you're running late without parking in the very far corner of the old COB/COE parking lots. I have issues with the new campus apartments in down town too.. Where are they gonna park? This past year they had to be close to maximum capacity for cars parked.



Parking was an "issue" when I was a student too...

we had fewer students but less parking...

What happens if you live ON campus and have an 8:00 class?

What's the usage of the 636 parking spots at the Cherry Street Multi-Modal Transportation Facility?

I believe I just counted 18-20 student, student/staff parking lots...

What's the total parking spaces on Campus?


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## IndyTreeFan

GuardShock said:


> As a student... We need more parking. If you have a 9:00 class and live off campus. *Good luck finding a spot if you're running late without parking in the very far corner of the old COB/COE parking lots.* I have issues with the new campus apartments in down town too.. Where are they gonna park? This past year they had to be close to maximum capacity for cars parked.



Don't mean to sound like a grumpy old man (although, in fact, that's exactly what I feel like today...), but in the real world, they would tell you *DON'T BE LATE* and if you are running late, you'd better know how to *RUN*!!!


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## Jason Svoboda

GuardShock said:


> As a student... We need more parking. If you have a 9:00 class and live off campus. Good luck finding a spot if you're running late without parking in the very far corner of the old COB/COE parking lots. I have issues with the new campus apartments in down town too.. Where are they gonna park? This past year they had to be close to maximum capacity for cars parked.



If you're running late you put yourself into that predicament. That's life. 

Although I agree there may not be close parking, there is technically enough parking. I still think they need to add a couple more parking garages at key spots on campus and be done with it, especially if Bradley is serious about hitting 17k.

As for the downtown apartments, you'll have to walk. That is how living downtown in most cities is or you'll pay through the nose for close parking. Let's be honest though... you can park less than a block away by the towers in most instances. My guess is they will give the apartment dwellers priority parking in that lot directly across the way on campus since those apartments will be premium rates. That's what I'd do.


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## Jason Svoboda

4Q_iu said:


> correct --- an implosion would create a helluva lot of concrete dust;  if it were a really rainy day; some/most of it would be suppressed.
> 
> the other reason for a wreaking ball --- the Eugene V. Debs House sits "next door" to the Towers;  I've heard they've been quite concerned about "living in the middle of a construction/demolition zone."
> 
> The important thing --- we're razing two unneeded, unattractive buildings.
> 
> As to green space...   I'm not convinced parking is such a DESPERATE issue.   If there's one thing an urban campus like State can use... MORE GREEN SPACE
> 
> IF (and that's a HELLUVA big if) parking is such a HUGE issue; ban cars for FROSH.



Desperate? No, but it can be very inconvenient. Additionally banning cars for freshman = kids looking elsewhere for school. Don't put your school at a disadvantage especially if you can easily rectify the situation. 

I don't think turning the old SOB/SOE into lots is the answer since it isn't close to anything but the SOE and Root and there are already lots there. IMO, putting a multi-level garage in 2 spots on campus could complete wipe away the parking situation for likely the rest of time. I'd put one on the corner of 4th and Cherry between the dorms and the bookstore/Foundation office and then one at the corner between the softball/Lincoln Quad area. Then you've bascially blanketed every corner of campus with tons of spaces and made it convenient.


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## treeman

Jason Svoboda said:


> *I'd put one on the corner of 4th and Cherry between the dorms and the bookstore/Foundation office* and then one at the corner between the softball/Lincoln Quad area.



that is a main corridor of campus, why would you want a parking garage to be the first thing 90% of visitors see? 

i'm honestly surprised that a deal hasn't been worked out with that one parking garage right next to the Hulman Center. And not that it's the most convenient location but there is another parking garage in downtown Terre Haute, i'm sure ISU could find a way to utilize it if need be. 

if they were to erect a parking garage near the demo site of the towers would be the best placement. And if they are trying to expand West, putting one relatively close to the new track wouldn't be a bad idea, as they say we are suppose to get a new football stadium in that directions anyways.


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## Jason Svoboda

treeman said:


> that is a main corridor of campus, why would you want a parking garage to be the first thing 90% of visitors see?
> 
> i'm honestly surprised that a deal hasn't been worked out with that one parking garage right next to the Hulman Center. And not that it's the most convenient location but there is another parking garage in downtown Terre Haute, i'm sure ISU could find a way to utilize it if need be.
> 
> if they were to erect a parking garage near the demo site of the towers would be the best placement. And if they are trying to expand West, putting one relatively close to the new track wouldn't be a bad idea, as they say we are suppose to get a new football stadium in that directions anyways.



Because that would be a fantastic location for it. Have you been to Loyola's campus? They have one smack dab in the middle of campus and it looks like all of the other buildings and isn't out of place. It makes their campus very centralized and convenient. Having a garage that could be dual purpose for both the staff, visitors and the residence halls makes too much sense. 

We're not getting a new football stadium. I'm convinced of it.


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## IndyTreeFan

treeman said:


> that is a main corridor of campus, why would you want a parking garage to be the first thing 90% of visitors see?
> 
> i'm honestly surprised that a deal hasn't been worked out with that one parking garage right next to the Hulman Center. And not that it's the most convenient location but there is another parking garage in downtown Terre Haute, i'm sure ISU could find a way to utilize it if need be.
> 
> if they were to erect a parking garage near the demo site of the towers would be the best placement. And if they are trying to expand West, putting one relatively close to the new track wouldn't be a bad idea, as they say we are suppose to get a new football stadium in that directions anyways.



ISU now owns that parking garage...


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## treeman

IndyTreeFan said:


> ISU now owns that parking garage...



which one?


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## Jason Svoboda

treeman said:


> which one?



The Cherry multimodal across from Hulman Center.


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## 4Q_iu

Jason Svoboda said:


> Desperate? No, but it can be very inconvenient. Additionally banning cars for freshman = kids looking elsewhere for school. Don't put your school at a disadvantage especially if you can easily rectify the situation.
> 
> I don't think turning the old SOB/SOE into lots is the answer since it isn't close to anything but the SOE and Root and there are already lots there. IMO, putting a multi-level garage in 2 spots on campus could complete wipe away the parking situation for likely the rest of time. I'd put one on the corner of 4th and Cherry between the dorms and the bookstore/Foundation office and then one at the corner between the softball/Lincoln Quad area. Then you've bascially blanketed every corner of campus with tons of spaces and made it convenient.




Here's a list of schools who currently ban cars for Freshman and/or other students...

Some AWFULLY good schools on the list and I doubt the car ban hurts them....

Johns Hopkins, Stanford, MIT, UVa, UNC, Cal-Berkley, Michigan, etc


http://www.aashe.org/resources/campus-car-bans


Should we, could we add parking?  Sure, not sure where I'd put the garage(s)... maybe the NW corner of campus; if they can keep it below the eyeline of traffic headed north on US-41...


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## Jason Svoboda

4Q_iu said:


> Here's a list of schools who currently ban cars for Freshman and/or other students...
> 
> Some AWFULLY good schools on the list and I doubt the car ban hurts them....
> 
> Johns Hopkins, Stanford, MIT, UVa, UNC, Cal-Berkley, Michigan, etc
> 
> 
> http://www.aashe.org/resources/campus-car-bans
> 
> 
> Should we, could we add parking?  Sure, not sure where I'd put the garage(s)... maybe the NW corner of campus; if they can keep it below the eyeline of traffic headed north on US-41...



Yeah, not sure we have similar academic profiles as those you mention.


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## 4Q_iu

Jason Svoboda said:


> Yeah, not sure we have similar academic profiles as those you mention.



Agree; some are betters, others are behind/below us.


I guess cars on campus for freshmen are as important as single rooms, private baths and central air in all dorms...


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## Jason Svoboda

4Q_iu said:


> Agree; some are betters, others are behind/below us.
> 
> I guess cars on campus for freshmen are as important as single rooms, private baths and central air in all dorms...



Yep, if you want to attract better students, you've got to have/offer endless ammenities and options. That's just the competitive market we're in. When you have a moment, take a look at some of the apartment "dorms" Arizona State has built with outdoor pools and what not. Crazy.


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## 4Q_iu

Jason Svoboda said:


> Yep, if you want to attract better students, you've got to have/offer endless ammenities and options. That's just the competitive market we're in. When you have a moment, take a look at some of the apartment "dorms" Arizona State has built with outdoor pools and what not. Crazy.



Noted --- couldn't tell you what Ariz State is known for EXCEPT being a 1-2 year drunken, naked brawl for thousands of kids from the Jersey / Philly / NYC and greater LA metro areas.

I've worked with two ASU grads in recent years; neither were bad people but felt their education was lacking...


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## bluestreak

Jason Svoboda said:


> Yep, if you want to attract better students, you've got to have/offer endless ammenities and options. That's just the competitive market we're in. When you have a moment, take a look at some of the apartment "dorms" Arizona State has built with outdoor pools and what not. Crazy.



I actually believe the student parking situation is okay...my comparison comes from my daughter. My youngest went to Mizzou and parking places are *assigned* for all students. As a freshman, my daughters parking slot was *three miles* from her dorm. As a sophomore she got to within a mile, but this was because she lived in a sorority that had their own set of slots. When students live in the dorms or in a Frat or sorority, they walk and walk and walk. If you want a walking campus, and believe me, the current ISU campus is a dream compared to when I attended in the 70's when the campus was dissected with city streets, then that means you have to park and walk.


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## IndyTreeFan

Students have been complaining about parking on campus since my parents were at ISU in the 50's.  Some things never change...


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## bluestreak

Forgot to mention the parking slot cost $300 a semester.


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## treeman

bluestreak said:


> Forgot to mention the parking slot cost $300 a semester.


Wow, do you know that for sure? The last time I baught a parking pass there was 2011 for $85 the year. So they raised the price $515 in 4 years?


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## SycamoreStateofMind

IndyTreeFan said:


> Students have been complaining about parking on campus since my parents were at ISU in the 50's.  Some things never change...



It doesn't seem to be just "students" on here who have a passion and extensive knowledge about parking. Amazing to me, the off season for major athletics starts and 4Q comes back to tell everyone how it is done... Lol

I do not think that a parking garage on campus is the solution right now - maybe in the future, but not right now. In the short term surface parking is a much more affordable option. 

The idea of freshman not having cars on campus is dumb, sorry that is what it is and it will never fly at Indiana State. We have plenty of areas to park, some just require people to walk further than they would like. 

So that is about all I have to say about parking. Oh and those damn towers needed to come down. They had no use for them and neither did the developers that looked at them. It's not as if the University didn't do their due diligence. They looked into it and found out that demolition or let 2 ugly ass building stand was the only real option.


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## niklz62

treeman said:


> Wow, do you know that for sure? The last time I baught a parking pass there was 2011 for $85 the year. So they raised the price $515 in 4 years?



i assumed he meant his daughter at Mizzou


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## niklz62

Its too bad they couldnt raffle off tickets to get to run the wrecking ball for a while.


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## 4Q_iu

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> It doesn't seem to be just "students" on here who have a passion and extensive knowledge about parking. Amazing to me, the off season for major athletics starts and 4Q comes back to tell everyone how it is done... Lol
> 
> I do not think that a parking garage on campus is the solution right now - maybe in the future, but not right now. In the short term surface parking is a much more affordable option.
> 
> The idea of freshman not having cars on campus is dumb, sorry that is what it is and it will never fly at Indiana State. We have plenty of areas to park, some just require people to walk further than they would like.
> 
> So that is about all I have to say about parking. Oh and those damn towers needed to come down. They had no use for them and neither did the developers that looked at them. It's not as if the University didn't do their due diligence. They looked into it and found out that demolition or let 2 ugly ass building stand was the only real option.



Thanks for your insight into parking --- it's REFRESHING to read ANOTHER post from The Haute.  

As everyone knows --- parking and 'Major Athletics' are LINKED so closely that without parking, we wouldn't have the MBB and Fball success we've realized in the recent past.

As Parking goes, so go the Fightin' Sycamores!


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