# 2015-16 MVC preview



## Southgrad07

Starting to get that itch for sycamore basketball so to get some discussion going I've done some research and this is what I think the MVC will look like this season. Feel free to agree/disagree or comment! 


1st- Wichita State- All American backcourt, Solid length on the wings and inside. Anton Grady is a big 5th yr senior guy to replace Carter. This is a top 5-10 team that will be the heavy favorites this season. They have a sniper guard who is eligible at Christmas (top 100 transfer from KU) that could be a huge lift off the bench. Some rumblings that 7ft SR freak athlete Bush Wamukota is much improved...Lets hope this is typical summer optimism. 

2nd- Evansville- This is strictly based on their roster. To me they by far have the most talented team top to bottom outside of WSU. Balentine and Mock are top 5 players in the league. Brzoja and Wiley are the keys for them. If Simmons allows those two to start and play more than Wing and  little Simmons... then your looking at an NCAA team. If he continues to play marty ball and those two...Well your looking at a mid pack valley team. They also have a 7'1 center transfer from Nebraska and an electric true FR pg in Harris Brown as players to watch for. 

3rd- Northern Iowa- This is where the discussion with Indiana State should begin talent wise. Looking at their roster and ours there is not much separation between the two. Jacobson is a more accomplished coach and they do have more returning at the center position. Would not shock me to see them finish 6th though. Brutal non conference schedule should test them . Decent center position play and guys like Jeremy Morgan and Wes Washpun  stepping up to become go to players are needed for them to reach the NCAA's. 

4th- Indiana State- I truly believe 1-4 this team is loaded. Brown and Scott is a very solid valley tandem at guard. Smith is a versatile wing and Van Sycoc will allow us to stretch the floor at the 4 and will be tough on the boards for his size. No secret around here the question mark is at center. Rickman and Bunschoten will get the most of the minutes there if you ask me. If Rickman can be a defensive presence and Neils can stretch the floor and be ok on the glass...I think we are in for a fun year. Lansing has said on numerous occasions this is his deepest team so guys like Burnett and Clemons are also expected to be major contributors.    

5th- Illinois State- Not sold on this team...but the talent is there for them to finish 2nd. Akoon- Purcell is absolutely an All valley wing and Paris lee will be the best defensive player in the league. They have a 5th yr transfer from a small school and a transfer from New Mexico who will probably man the middle for them. Both undersized, but athletic and fit their long and athletic style. Also not sold on their coach as being on par with Lansing. If our guys get sufficient  answers up front I like us to be better than this team.

6th- Loyola- Another team much like ours that could be 2nd or 6th based on what they get from key spots. No doubt Doyle is a stud and Peterson and Turk are nice wings to put around him. Montel James is tough nosed typical valley big. They have a JC transfer (former V.Tech player) in 6'9 240 Maurice Kirby that is a big piece for what they want to do and will determine whether they move up or stay here.. Ben  Richardson and Donte Ingram are also x factors for them. Both had solid freshman campaigns, but will need to have a big sophomore yeasr for them to compete for that 2nd position. 

7th- Drake- Like some of their young pieces. Billy Wampler is a good looking freshman wing from Wisconsin. The 7ft foreign freshman is a good looking project but Jacob Enevold is still going to be required to be the workhorse up front.  Getting guys who played part time minutes on bad big ten teams should start and help the depth on this team (pg- Graham Woodard  and sf/pf- Kale Abrahamson). Losing shooters like Ricks and Daniels to go along with wings in Berkley and Caird will probably prove to be too much to overcome for this young bulldog team. Better days ahead for this group. 

-*This is where the league gets bad-*

8th- Southern Illinois- Anthony Beane is an all valley 2nd team type player and elite scorer at guard. O'Brien is scrappy and a nice piece. Leo Vincent (JC) pg) will be required to be a big time PG if their best recruit is not eligible (which it looks that way)... underperforming veteran bigs in Bola Olaniyan and Ibby Djimide need to have big years for this team to do anything.

9th- Bradley- Could argue this team for 8th because I like their coach. Wardle should be able to turn this around in time. As for this year they only have 3 returning players and nobody who strikes fear in the opponent. Some of their true freshman look good, including the pg from Richmond Indiana. This group is a year away from respectability and 2 or 3 from doing anything meaningful. 

10th- Missouri State- Lusk is a bad coach. He has had problems getting some of his  junior college recruits eligible (foote and baker). His returning players are pedestrian outside of Chris Kendrix. Dequon Miller was a big time JC recruit ( only got him because they hired his jc head coach as an assistant ) who must be electric for them to finish top 7. Could see this team going south fast if they get off to a poor start.


----------



## ISUCC

nice thorough review! MUCH better than all the other MVC pre season reviews floating around on the internet!


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Good stuff Kyle. 

I think that 3 through 6 in the MVC are interchangeable. I could easily see Loyola getting up for 3rd in this league with a talented roster, a serviceable coach in Porter Moser and I think they are trending in the right direction. 

If I were doing the rankings I would actually have put Loyola at the 4, ISURed at the 5 and the Sycamores at the 6. We still have a lot of unanswered questions: 

1. Can KSmith carry the load? We talked last year in the pre-season about the leap we expected and or needed him to take. It didn't happen - so we should be asking the same question again? This year he has the opportunity to get his confidence back and improve on a disappointing campaign for him last year. 

2. Will Scott have a starting position or will Lansing bring him off the bench? How will he handle that? Scott worked hard to earn his starting spot and seems to thrive in that role. Some kids don't mind coming off the bench, some kids get added confidence from being in that starting lineup. Either way we are going to need Scott to continue to progress as he had a nice season last year for us. Asking him to duplicate that 44% 3pt average might be asking a lot. 

3. Who will fill the void left by TJ Bell's injury? A lot will be asked of Rickman and Niels neither of which have played a minute of D1 basketball. I personally think that matters a lot and I am not willing to take a stance on how they will be able to fulfill that role without seeing either of them in person. 

4. Lastly, how quickly will we forget that drubbing Loyola put on us in St. Louis last year? Personally I hope they never forget - you got to move on and it was last season but I hope they never forget that. I know it left a bitter taste in the mouth of Lansing and alumni. If you can't get up to play in March in St. Louis then I have to question our leadership and toughness both of which are huge question marks for me heading in this season. 

Every team has questions in the off season - we are not alone. I am just not ready to call us a 3rd or 4th place team in this league, not without seeing some of our new additions for myself.


----------



## treeman

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> 1. Can KSmith carry the load? We talked last year in the pre-season about the leap we expected and or needed him to take. It didn't happen - so we should be asking the same question again? This year he has the opportunity to get his confidence back and improve on a disappointing campaign for him last year.



I'm hoping that Smith finds himself this year. I believe that last year was hard psychologically for him...He was suppose to be "the guy" for last years team, but Brown improves big-time and we have a freshman named Scott that stole the show most of the games. It's hard to perform at a high level when your head isn't in the right spot. I'm hoping that the off season gave him some time to find what he needs to do for the team to get back to being the spark plug and energizer he was his sophomore season.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

treeman said:


> I'm hoping that Smith finds himself this year. I believe that last year was hard psychologically for him...He was suppose to be "the guy" for last years team, but Brown improves big-time and we have a freshman named Scott that stole the show most of the games. It's hard to perform at a high level when your head isn't in the right spot. I'm hoping that the off season gave him some time to find what he needs to do for the team to get back to being the spark plug and energizer he was his sophomore season.



I don't buy that personally. Most programs need 2-3 "the guy" types anymore and IMO he just settled damn near all season long. Way, way, way too many long 2 point attempts and 3 point attempts. He had 80 of his 270 attempts from 3s and I bet if you looked at his shot chart,  I bet 60%+ of the remaining were jump shots with 30-40% of those being outside 15 feet. 

For a guy that shoots damn near 80% from the line and can get up, he should be attacking the rim continuously because one of three things happen and two of them are good.


----------



## Southgrad07

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> Good stuff Kyle.
> 
> I think that 3 through 6 in the MVC are interchangeable. I could easily see Loyola getting up for 3rd in this league with a talented roster, a serviceable coach in Porter Moser and I think they are trending in the right direction.
> 
> If I were doing the rankings I would actually have put Loyola at the 4, ISURed at the 5 and the Sycamores at the 6. We still have a lot of unanswered questions:
> 
> 1. Can KSmith carry the load? We talked last year in the pre-season about the leap we expected and or needed him to take. It didn't happen - so we should be asking the same question again? This year he has the opportunity to get his confidence back and improve on a disappointing campaign for him last year.
> 
> 2. Will Scott have a starting position or will Lansing bring him off the bench? How will he handle that? Scott worked hard to earn his starting spot and seems to thrive in that role. Some kids don't mind coming off the bench, some kids get added confidence from being in that starting lineup. Either way we are going to need Scott to continue to progress as he had a nice season last year for us. Asking him to duplicate that 44% 3pt average might be asking a lot.
> 
> 3. Who will fill the void left by TJ Bell's injury? A lot will be asked of Rickman and Niels neither of which have played a minute of D1 basketball. I personally think that matters a lot and I am not willing to take a stance on how they will be able to fulfill that role without seeing either of them in person.
> 
> 4. Lastly, how quickly will we forget that drubbing Loyola put on us in St. Louis last year? Personally I hope they never forget - you got to move on and it was last season but I hope they never forget that. I know it left a bitter taste in the mouth of Lansing and alumni. If you can't get up to play in March in St. Louis then I have to question our leadership and toughness both of which are huge question marks for me heading in this season.
> 
> Every team has questions in the off season - we are not alone. I am just not ready to call us a 3rd or 4th place team in this league, not without seeing some of our new additions for myself.



Totally agree 3-6 are similar and actually when you factor in the effects of Marty ball 2-6 really is a guessing game. Overall I think the talent base for the top 6 is better than previous years. To answer some of your questions though....

1. I don't think K.Smith needs to "carry the load". I think some of our early season struggles a year ago stemmed from our team and staff kind of putting all of our eggs in that basket. Tough to blame the staff for that one because I remember several fans (myself included) saying he was ready to take that leap. If he comes out much improved and capable of 14 and 6 a night?? Great!!... If he continues to be our 3rd of 4th best scoring option and most versatile defender? I don't think that would mean trouble for our team. As someone eluded to , Brown and Scott proved more than capable in the scoring department and Van Sycoc figures to put up 10+ points a game. 

2. I haven't seen Clemons in action yet so I can't answer this one. I will say that if it is close I think you go with Scott. He is a plus shooter (which Smith and Brown have not been, Brown more improved than Smith) and earned the spot last year with excellent play. At the end of the day i'm not as concerned with who starts as who plays that last 5 minutes of the game. 

3. By far the most concerning of the 4 and another we won't know until they lace em up for real. The two have the size to play the position (6'9 and 6'8) but strength and experience in the valley is worrisome. I definitely don't see one guy stepping up and playing the position for 25-30 minutes a game. It will have to be done in tandem and would be nice if Murphy is of some value too. The fact we are talking about two guys who have not played D1 over him is not exactly a ringing endorsement. i will say from what i've seen he does seem to be in a little better shape and that was part of his issue last season... So prove us wrong big fella!

4. Well I know I won't forget it. Single most embarrassing Sycamore effort I've witnessed. Like you said considering what was at stake it was just unacceptable. I somehow think Lansing will make sure they at least keep it in the back of their minds.


----------



## IndyTreeFan

Don't forget, this is the most talented team we've had in 5 years.  As last year was the most talented team in four years.  And the year before that, and the year before that...:razz:

We'll be a play in team this year, unless some magic happens.  I'm hoping for the magic, but being an ISU fan has taught me not to expect it...


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Are people really that high on UNI? 

They lost all of their post players Tuttle, Buss, Singleton as well as Valley tested PG Deon Mitchell. Yes, they return some talent and some talented freshman bigs but that is a LOT to lose and stay in the 3rd spot in the Valley, no?


----------



## treeman

Jason Svoboda said:


> I don't buy that personally. Most programs need 2-3 "the guy" types anymore and IMO he just settled damn near all season long. Way, way, way too many long 2 point attempts and 3 point attempts. He had 80 of his 270 attempts from 3s and I bet if you looked at his shot chart,  I bet 60%+ of the remaining were jump shots with 30-40% of those being outside 15 feet.
> 
> For a guy that shoots damn near 80% from the line and can get up, he should be attacking the rim continuously because one of three things happen and two of them are good.



Not disagreeing with you, but the psychological aspect of sports is way underrated. As a former athlete at ISU, it was amazing how the right and wrong mindset either hampered or helped your on the court/field/track performance. And whether  you want to believe it or not when you are "suppose" to be top dog and you aren't, it really does f*** with your mind. Some coaches (mostly from individual sports like track, swimming, XC, etc.) won't let some athletes practice with each, because sometimes one athlete will shut down if they start to lose races/events in practice that they are suppose to win and that will carry over to game situations. It really is an interesting aspect to sports that is not talked about a lot.


----------



## sycamorebacker

IndyTreeFan said:


> Don't forget, this is the most talented team we've had in 5 years.  As last year was the most talented team in four years.  And the year before that, and the year before that...:razz:
> 
> We'll be a play in team this year, unless some magic happens.  I'm hoping for the magic, but being an ISU fan has taught me not to expect it...



Well, there is no doubt we haven't been this deep since 2000 or so, but we do have to find some play in the middle, and we need to see good team play and good defense.

Anything less than 3rd would disappoint.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

treeman said:


> Not disagreeing with you, but the psychological aspect of sports is way underrated. As a former athlete at ISU, it was amazing how the right and wrong mindset either hampered or helped your on the court/field/track performance. And whether  you want to believe it or not when you are "suppose" to be top dog and you aren't, it really does f*** with your mind. Some coaches (mostly from individual sports like track, swimming, XC, etc.) won't let some athletes practice with each, because sometimes one athlete will shut down if they start to lose races/events in practice that they are suppose to win and that will carry over to game situations. It really is an interesting aspect to sports that is not talked about a lot.



I hear you but I aint buying what you are selling with relation to the Smith situation at least the way you drew it up. I too have seen guys absolutely domonate in practice and you put them in a meet (my personal experience) and they just shut down. 

The idea of Brown and or Scott stealing his thunder is what I am not convinced of. I think Jason was spot on and it had more to do with shot selection and how he decided to settle rather than attack. When Smith attacks he is a much better and different player - he is really a tough match-up when he is not settling for jump shots. The funny thing is, when he attacks the rim his shot actually comes to him better. Brown or Scott didn't steal any thunder of anyone. Both of those guys got plenty of scrutiny in the media and on this forum. It aint a Jake Odum vs. Carl Richard vs. Lathan situation in which those guys were already established players and a local frosh comes in and gets a lot of press.


----------



## TreeTop

My semi-educated guess at our Starting Four for Game 1 vs IUPUI

Everett Clemons -- Lansing seems high on this true point guard.
Devonte Brown -- Obvious Choice.
Khristian Smith -- Obvious Choice.
Matt Van Scyoc -- I'm calling it now, will be our leading scorer.

After these Four, I think it's tough to figure out. It's hard to believe that Rickman, a true freshman, who has already been described as raw would start at center.  The Murphquake isn't there yet, in terms of a starter.  Niels...maybe, but doubtful and I HAVE NO IDEA.   Scott...sure, we could go super small for a starting five.  Burnett...assuming he's FULLY recovered from his injury, would be my choice, and we'd have a small starting five.


----------



## Bluethunder

It will not surprise me to see Rickman as the starter.  Not predicting it, but it will not surprise me.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

Quabachi said:


> My semi-educated guess at our Starting Four for Game 1 vs IUPUI
> 
> Everett Clemons -- Lansing seems high on this true point guard.
> Devonte Brown -- Obvious Choice.
> Khristian Smith -- Obvious Choice.
> Matt Van Scyoc -- I'm calling it now, will be our leading scorer.
> 
> After these Four, I think it's tough to figure out. It's hard to believe that Rickman, a true freshman, who has already been described as raw would start at center.  The Murphquake isn't there yet, in terms of a starter.  Niels...maybe, but doubtful and I HAVE NO IDEA.   Scott...sure, we could go super small for a starting five.  Burnett...assuming he's FULLY recovered from his injury, would be my choice, and we'd have a small starting five.


I'm in total agreement, except for who will be our leading scorer. Hands down it will be Brown. [emoji92] [emoji94] [emoji93]


----------



## Southgrad07

Elder Tracy D. Smith said:


> I'm in total agreement, except for who will be our leading scorer. Hands down it will be Brown. [emoji92] [emoji94] [emoji93]



Should be very proud of Devonte, he has came a long way since his freshman year! As for him being our leading scorer... Im good that or with it being anyone else... as long as it helps lead to Sycamore victories!


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

My reasoning is because of all of his off-season work on his jump-shot, decision-making and free throw shooting.. We all know he can get to the rack and score.


----------



## Sycamore Proud

Not sure about all 5, but I don't see Scott sitting.  At least not early in the season.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Sycamore Proud said:


> Not sure about all 5, but I don't see Scott sitting.  At least not early in the season.



I AGREE.  It almost sounds like a joke to have the conference FOY not starting.  For Scott to not start, Clemons would REALLY have to be an exceptional player.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

It's hard to see Scott taking a backseat to a JUCO player, no matter what his credentials are. Scott is battle tested. #SmallBallHereWeCome


----------



## sycamorebacker

Elder Tracy D. Smith said:


> It's hard to see Scott taking a backseat to a JUCO player, no matter what his credentials are. Scott is battle tested. #SmallBallHereWeCome



Some on here know that I have been very excited about Scott ever since I saw him in the HS Top 40 and he has not disappointed me.  You are right -- it would take a heck of a juco to walk in the gym and put his shoes on.


----------



## TreeTop

I don't see it as a "backseat" to anybody...it's more about being a true point guard, which Scott is not.  Let him play 30+ minutes off the bench, be a scorer, win the 6th man award.  That's not a "backseat".


----------



## sycamorebacker

Quabachi said:


> I don't see it as a "backseat" to anybody...it's more about being a true point guard, which Scott is not.  Let him play 30+ minutes off the bench, be a scorer, win the 6th man award.  That's not a "backseat".



That's silly.  You start your best lineup and Scott IS IN your best lineup.  You don't start someone because you must start a true PG.


----------



## TreeTop

sycamorebacker said:


> That's silly.  You start your best lineup and Scott IS IN your best lineup.  You don't start someone because you must start a true PG.



Uhhhhh....yeah you do.   You start the better point guard at point guard.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Quabachi said:


> Uhhhhh....yeah you do.   You start the better point guard at point guard.



Uh.  No you don't.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

Quabachi said:


> I don't see it as a "backseat" to anybody...it's more about being a true point guard, which Scott is not.  Let him play 30+ minutes off the bench, be a scorer, win the 6th man award.  That's not a "backseat".


That's one way of looking at it. However, let's not forget that he was a finalist for National Freshman of the Year.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Quabachi said:


> Uhhhhh....yeah you do.   You start the better point guard at point guard.



I think there is some agreement on here that we might not be starting our best center.  I think you need to have your best 5 (if possible) on the floor most of the time IF that is your most effective lineup.  All I'm saying is that Scott could be in our best lineup.


----------



## TreeTop

When I think of Point Guard, I think of ball handler.  And I would rather a true point guard with exceptional ball handling skills start at point guard.  More specifically, I want Scott having ball dished to him, not him dishing it out.  He's a scorer.


----------



## TreeTop

sycamorebacker said:


> I think there is some agreement on here that we might not be starting our best center.  I think you need to have your best 5 (if possible) on the floor most of the time IF that is your most effective lineup.  All I'm saying is that Scott could be in our best lineup.



There's definitely agreement.  I would love to have Scott start (with Brown, Smith, Clemons, and Van Scyoc) and have a small starting 5, I have no problem with that.


----------



## bluebill

Great discussion, and looking forward to see just who pops out of this bunch.  Have you all overlooked Laquarious?  Hr CAN defend !!


----------



## sycamorebacker

bluebill said:


> Great discussion, and looking forward to see just who pops out of this bunch.  Have you all overlooked Laquarious?  Hr CAN defend !!



He is definitely the unknown as far as I know.  I don't know if anybody else has any update on him.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Quabachi said:


> When I think of Point Guard, I think of ball handler.  And I would rather a true point guard with exceptional ball handling skills start at point guard.  More specifically, I want Scott having ball dished to him, not him dishing it out.  He's a scorer.



I agree with all of that.  Sometimes, I think there is too much dribbling and not enough passing.  If I had my "rathers" I would like to have 5 passers on the floor.  I think the 3 guards would give us a lot of quickness on offense and a lot of shortness on defense.


----------



## Sycamore Proud

sycamorebacker said:


> I agree with all of that.  Sometimes, I think there is *too much dribbling and not enough passing.*  If I had my "rathers" I would like to have 5 passers on the floor.  I think the 3 guards would give us a lot of quickness on offense and a lot of shortness on defense.



True at all levels.  It's all to common for young coaches to not recognize that and encourage putting the ball on the floor.


----------



## Bluethunder

If I had to guess as to a starting lineup on opening night, i would probably go with Everett, Brown, Smith, Van Scyoc and Bunschoten.  Scott and Burnett first off the bench with Rickman also getting quality minutes.


----------



## sycamorebacker

You guys might as well write this down.  Brown will start the season as our starting PG unless we go with 3 guards.


----------



## bluebill

This entire thread has been about offence....I would bet the coach is looking hard at the other end of the floor action, and perhaps not as starters but you can bet on PT. 
Thoughts on who can defend ???:huh:


----------



## Jason Svoboda

bluebill said:


> This entire thread has been about offence....I would bet the coach is looking hard at the other end of the floor action, and perhaps not as starters but you can bet on PT.
> Thoughts on who can defend ???:huh:



All of 'em. They typically don't recruit guys that don't defend or at least work hard at trying to.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

sycamorebacker said:


> You guys might as well write this down.  Brown will start the season as our starting PG unless we go with 3 guards.



Which may not be a stretch against some teams. 

That said, does it really matter who starts? There hasn't been one year that I recall that the top 3 guards on the roster all didn't get at least 25mpg and in most years the 4th guy typically is between 18-22mpg. I'm more interested who will be on the floor when we finish games.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Southgrad07 said:


> 3. By far the most concerning of the 4 and another we won't know until they lace em up for real. The two have the size to play the position (6'9 and 6'8) but strength and experience in the valley is worrisome. I definitely don't see one guy stepping up and playing the position for 25-30 minutes a game. It will have to be done in tandem and would be nice if Murphy is of some value too. The fact we are talking about two guys who have not played D1 over him is not exactly a ringing endorsement. i will say from what i've seen he does seem to be in a little better shape and that was part of his issue last season... So prove us wrong big fella!



Only Murphy mention in the thread. If there is a guy on the roster that has been basically had the red carpet rolled out for him, it's that guy. If he didn't take this offseason serious to work on his low post moves and shed some of his bad weight, not sure he'll ever make an impact here. Dude has 25mpg (if not more) staring him right in the face if he takes it.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Jason Svoboda said:


> I'm more interested who will be on the floor when we finish games.



Yes, that's an old cliche that don't mean nothing.  With matchups and "who's hot" considered, you want your best lineup at the end of the game.  And you also want your best lineup at the beginning and as much as possible in the middle.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Jason Svoboda said:


> Only Murphy mention in the thread. Dude has 25mpg (if not more) staring him right in the face if he takes it.



Doesn't anybody know anything about how our bigs are looking?  When do they start practicing?


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

bluebill said:


> Great discussion, and looking forward to see just who pops out of this bunch.  Have you all overlooked Laquarious?  Hr CAN defend !!


But can he defend ???

 Small ball, everyone has to defend exceptionally like a well oiled machine, if it's going to be successful.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

sycamorebacker said:


> You guys might as well write this down.  Brown will start the season as our starting PG unless we go with 3 guards.


Or unless Brown signs off on Clemons. But my money is on Scott getting the opening day starts. Scott is battle tested !!!


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

Jason Svoboda said:


> Which may not be a stretch against some teams.
> 
> That said, does it really matter who starts? There hasn't been one year that I recall that the top 3 guards on the roster all didn't get at least 25mpg and in most years the 4th guy typically is between 18-22mpg. I'm more interested who will be on the floor when we finish games.


Scott, Smith, MVS, Rickman, & Brown


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

sycamorebacker said:


> Doesn't anybody know anything about how our bigs are looking?  When do they start practicing?


Our Bigs are coming along slowly. There main focus has been conditioning thus far. However, Rickman has been a force (defensively). [emoji3]


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

bluebill said:


> Great discussion, and looking forward to see just who pops out of this bunch.  Have you all overlooked Laquarious?  Hr CAN defend !!



And you know that from what? The 10 minutes of game action you have seen of him? Get out of here with that. Defending is one thing, being able to be a an elite "ALL CAPS" defender at the D1 level is totally different. You haven't seen him defend off the ball, you have seen him defend in isolation, you haven't seen him defend in the pick and roll yadda yadda. Yes I have overlooked him on purpose.


----------



## sycamorebacker

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> And you know that from what? The 10 minutes of game action you have seen of him? Get out of here with that. Defending is one thing, being able to be a an elite "ALL CAPS" defender at the D1 level is totally different. You haven't seen him defend off the ball, you have seen him defend in isolation, you haven't seen him defend in the pick and roll yadda yadda. Yes I have overlooked him on purpose.



What the hell's the matter with your head?  You know, some fans go to practices and some fans know things you don't know.


----------



## bluebill

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> And you know that from what? The 10 minutes of game action you have seen of him? Get out of here with that. Defending is one thing, being able to be a an elite "ALL CAPS" defender at the D1 level is totally different. You haven't seen him defend off the ball, you have seen him defend in isolation, you haven't seen him defend in the pick and roll yadda yadda. Yes I have overlooked him on purpose.



SSAM he was not on the floor very much but if you did not see him defend while there. you were not watching my friend.  Given a chance he will show well.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

bluebill said:


> SSAM he was not on the floor very much but if you did not see him defend while there. you were not watching my friend.  Given a chance he will show well.



I was probably not watching then... That would probably be a fair statement.

 At any rate, I don't think he is going to be much of a factor on this roster. We are guard heavy as is and I really am not sure where he fits unless someone gets hurt which is always a possibility.


----------



## TreeTop

I agree that Q probably won't get much PT this year, but I'm high on him from the little bit he played last year, his D, and his (perceived) maturity.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Quabachi said:


> I agree that Q probably won't get much PT this year, but I'm high on him from the little bit he played last year, his D, and his (perceived) maturity.



I don't dislike him, he hasn't given me a reason to dislike him as a basketball player. I just don't think he is good enough to play on this roster. Admittedly I haven't seen much of him. Hope to make it to a practice or two soon and see for myself. Perhaps I will have an attitude adjustment on him.


----------



## TreeTop

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> Perhaps I will have an attitude adjustment on him.



I don't take what you said as having an attitude toward him, I completely agree that with the number of guards on this roster, he's gonna be low on the totem pole in terms of PT.  Prob less than 10 min a game.


----------



## TreeTop

#130 Ramblers:  http://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/11668

#101 Sycamores http://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/11775

#72 Purple Aces:  http://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/11875

#53 Panthers:  http://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/11923

#47 Redbirds:  http://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/11939

So Far.


----------



## Bluethunder

If Evansville is only the 72 best team in the country and the 4th best in the MVC, Marty is toast.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Quabachi said:


> I don't take what you said as having an attitude toward him, I completely agree that with the number of guards on this roster, he's gonna be low on the totem pole in terms of PT.  Prob less than 10 min a game.



But that is pure speculation, right?


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Quabachi said:


> I don't take what you said as having an attitude toward him, I completely agree that with the number of guards on this roster, he's gonna be low on the totem pole in terms of PT.  Prob less than 10 min a game.



He averaged 10mpg in the 4 games he played last year. My guess is if he is 100% healthy and invested, he'll get more as he'll likely steal some of Prusator's minutes. IIRC, Etherington also played some 2 in situations last year so there are some more minutes to be had. 

Brown (30+), Scott (near 30 IIRC) and Tre (20-25mpg) were the top earners. Can't remember where Prusator was... assume 15-20.


----------



## TreeTop

Last year's minutes for guards and more (rounded to nearest minute):

Brown 33
Scott 29
Smith 30
Tre 22
Etherington 15
Prusator 8
LaQuarious 10 (four games)


----------



## Southgrad07

Quabachi said:


> Last year's minutes for guards and more (rounded to nearest minute):
> 
> Brown 33
> Scott 29
> Smith 30
> Tre 22
> Etherington 15
> Prusator 8
> LaQuarious 10 (four games)



Not going to go look it up but weren't most if not all of Q's games played when Etherington was out with injury? If so these numbers are mute because it's not like Eitherington and Paige were combining for 25 minutes a night. Essentially Q only played that much because Etherington was out. Also Paige had a cast on his hand while playing, so I don't think we got a true sense of what he could do. I truly have no idea what Q is going to give us this year, but I do know that he is in a crowded backcourt. So only 10-12 minutes a game is not out of the question.


----------



## sycamorebacker

If we average 2.5 guards on the floor, we have 100 min per game.

I think we should want Brown, Scott and Clemons to all play well enough to get 75-85 of those minutes.

Of course, if someone else is good enough to get minutes that's all the better.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Yeah I haven't seen enough from Q at this point to expect him to steal minutes from Prusator. Yes, that is completely speculative on my part. I did see Q play and he didn't do anything in those 4 games to sway in the direction of him stealing minutes from anyone who might be ahead of him in the depth charts and that includes Prusator. Because as things sit right now, not only are we more crowded at the 1 and 2 we are more crowded at the 3/4 with Smith, Van Scyoc and Burnett. Last year basically it was Smith at the 3 and a little bit of Ethrington but at 15 minutes a game not much. 

So yeah I would say 5 to 10 mins per game average is about all you are going to see from Q, again unless someone gets injured which changes everything.


----------



## sycamorebacker

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> we are more crowded at the 3/4 with Smith, Van Scyoc and Burnett.



I don't consider 3 players for the 3-4 as crowded.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

sycamorebacker said:


> I don't consider 3 players for the 3-4 as crowded.



Yeah, you're probably right that is much less crowded than 4-5 players deep would be.


----------



## TreeTop

http://www.midmajormadness.com/rankings/2015/10/6/9459255/preseason-mid-major-power-15-released

MidMajorMadness Pre-Season Mid-Major Power 15...

WSU, Evansville, and UNI make the list, along with Valpo.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Again, can anyone explain why UNI is so highly thought of losing what they just lost?


----------



## TreeTop

Jason Svoboda said:


> Again, can anyone explain why UNI is so highly thought of losing what they just lost?



No reasonable person.


----------



## IndyTreeFan

Jason Svoboda said:


> Again, can anyone explain why UNI is so highly thought of losing what they just lost?



It's really pretty simple - it's their reputation based on some honest success.  Yeah, it's not every year, but every three or four years, UNI puts out a really, really good team.  And in those intervening years, they're above average.  So, when you don't constantly dance with mediocrity or less, you get this kind of respect, which is nothing more than good publicity.  Which helps with recruiting, donors, etc.

The rest of the league, save Wichita, could learn something from Jacobsen and his system of producing results.

I.e. - they're a safe bet and won't make the writer look too bad...


----------



## TreeTop

IndyTreeFan said:


> It's really pretty simple - it's their reputation based on some honest success.  Yeah, it's not every year, but every three or four years, UNI puts out a really, really good team.  And in those intervening years, they're above average.  So, when you don't constantly dance with mediocrity or less, you get this kind of respect, which is nothing more than good publicity.  Which helps with recruiting, donors, etc.
> 
> The rest of the league, save Wichita, could learn something from Jacobsen and his system of producing results.
> 
> I.e. - they're a safe bet and won't make the writer look too bad...



That sounds reasonable.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

IndyTreeFan said:


> It's really pretty simple - it's their reputation based on some honest success.  Yeah, it's not every year, but every three or four years, UNI puts out a really, really good team.  And in those intervening years, they're above average.  So, when you don't constantly dance with mediocrity or less, you get this kind of respect, which is nothing more than good publicity.  Which helps with recruiting, donors, etc.
> 
> The rest of the league, save Wichita, could learn something from Jacobsen and his system of producing results.
> 
> I.e. - they're a safe bet and won't make the writer look too bad...



Jason - that is pretty good stuff, you caught me looking for a good "reasonable" answer and I couldn't come up with one. I was stumped.

But this is pure gold, this was as good of a reason as you could find. Suggesting it had more to do with the reputation of the program and the coach than with the product on the court.

Guess what - college basketball at the highest of levels works like this every year! Top down logic and sound at that ITF!


----------



## treeman

I am really looking forward to eville underperforming (again). I am not convinced that eville or UNI is going to have more talent than us. Ballentine is good only because the system is designed for him. Mock however is someone I would take in a heart beat and will be a TERRIBLE matchup for us. 

When eville misses the NCAAs and NIT how many more years does Simmons have?


----------



## wufan

Jason Svoboda said:


> Again, can anyone explain why UNI is so highly thought of losing what they just lost?



Remember too that UNI was 16-2 last year. A four game slip puts them at 12-6, and right in the hunt for second place.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

wufan said:


> Remember too that UNI was 16-2 last year. A four game slip puts them at 12-6, and right in the hunt for second place.



Tuttle, Buss, Singleton (entire front line) and senior PG Deon Mitchell is only a four game drop? 

Maybe that Valley isn't as strong as everyone thinks?


----------



## IndyTreeFan

Jason Svoboda said:


> Tuttle, Buss, Singleton (entire front line) and senior PG Deon Mitchell is only a four game drop?
> 
> Maybe that Valley isn't as strong as everyone thinks?



Let's face it, Jason, the Valley isn't much after Wichita...


----------



## wufan

Jason Svoboda said:


> Tuttle, Buss, Singleton (entire front line) and senior PG Deon Mitchell is only a four game drop?
> 
> Maybe that Valley isn't as strong as everyone thinks?



I don't think UNI misses a beat at the PG spot. Washpun plus Lohaus should cover that. 

Singleton and Buss were nice players. I don't think they were as god as Kitchell or Gant, and UNI has three sophomore bigs in their third year. I think they should be able to adequately replace those two. I think Tuttle was worth 4 games. 

In all honesty I think UNI, UE, ISUb, ISUr, and LUC all have a shot at 20+ wins, second place, and with some luck, a shot at an at-large bid. I can't really separate the five, and in that case, you go with talent or coaching. Looks like these pollsters took the team with the best coaching resume and the team with the biggest star-power. ISUr isn't far behind in talent and ISUb isn't far behind in coaching. The slight differences between the top/middle of the Valley will sort itself out.


----------



## sycamorebacker

I'm thinking we might surprise some people with our "talent."


----------



## TreeTop

MVC Preview from CBS SPORTS...

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...ference-predictions-wichita-state-still-rules

6. INDIANA STATE SYCAMORES

The Sycamores' names to know: Devonte Brown and Brenton Scott, the latter being the best freshman in the league last season and maybe will be the best player in the MVC come 2017. ISU is definitely going to run, and it should. This will hurt it against WSU, but it might wind up being that ISU wins all of its games against the bottom four in the league while going .500 against the rest.


----------



## BrokerZ

Quabachi said:


> MVC Preview from CBS SPORTS...
> 
> http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...ference-predictions-wichita-state-still-rules
> 
> 6. INDIANA STATE SYCAMORES
> 
> The Sycamores' names to know: Devonte Brown and Brenton Scott, the latter being the best freshman in the league last season and maybe will be the best player in the MVC come 2017. ISU is definitely going to run, and it should. This will hurt it against WSU, but it might wind up being that ISU wins all of its games against the bottom four in the league while going .500 against the rest.



I'm not sure how serious we can take this CBS article...I think it's a parody.  It states that Illinois State is well coached, and they have Muller as Coach of the Year!??!?!?!??!   You definitely have to question the research put into this article with that kind of statement.  Otherwise, though, I pretty much agree with the write-up . WSU is on top, that's obvious.  Evansville, UNI, Illinois State, Indiana State, and Loyola are all in the middle.  You can pretty much mix and match and make an argument that any of those schools will be 2nd or 6th.  Then, there's everybody else.  

That's kind of been the Valley's M.O. over the last few years, really.  WSU is clearly on top, there is a large grouping right in the middle, and the bad teams are really, really bad.  Outside of UNI kind of bucking that trend last year, I don't see any reason why that changes this year.


----------



## TreeTop

I've got 10 minutes to kill, so here are my totally stupid and without merit picks...(and I'm using the number 32 for total games arbitrarily, pre-ArchMadness)...

WSU  14-4  24-8
UE     13-5  23-9
ISU    13-5  21-11
IlS     12-6  23-9
LU      11-7  20-12
UNI     10-8  18-14
SIU     9-9    16-16
BU      4-14   10-22
MSU    4-14   9-23
DU      3-15   7-25

This is so dumb, it was fun.


----------



## sycamore tuff

Here are my picks for this year.

1.   Wichita State
2.   Southern Illinois
3.   Northern Iowa
4.   Missouri State
5.   Loyola
6.   Indiana State
7.   Illinois State
8.   Evansville
9.   Drake 
10. Bradley


----------



## sycamorebacker

sycamore tuff said:


> Here are my picks for this year.
> 
> 1.   Wichita State
> 2.   Southern Illinois
> 3.   Northern Iowa
> 4.   Missouri State
> 5.   Loyola
> 6.   Indiana State
> 7.   Illinois State
> 8.   Evansville
> 9.   Drake
> 10. Bradley



Why do you think WSU will be better than SIU?


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

sycamore tuff said:


> Here are my picks for this year.
> 
> 1.   Wichita State
> 2.   Southern Illinois
> 3.   Northern Iowa
> 4.   Missouri State
> 5.   Loyola
> 6.   Indiana State
> 7.   Illinois State
> 8.   Evansville
> 9.   Drake
> 10. Bradley


Indiana State will finish in second place


----------



## sycamorebacker

Elder Tracy D. Smith said:


> Indiana State will finish in second place



I'll go with 2nd or 3rd.  The problem is, one game can make a difference between 2nd and 6th.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

sycamorebacker said:


> I'll go with 2nd or 3rd.  The problem is, one game can make a difference between 2nd and 6th.


Your absolutely right.[emoji56]


----------



## BrokerZ

sycamore tuff said:


> Here are my picks for this year.
> 
> 1.   Wichita State
> 2.   Southern Illinois
> 3.   Northern Iowa
> 4.   Missouri State
> 5.   Loyola
> 6.   Indiana State
> 7.   Illinois State
> 8.   Evansville
> 9.   Drake
> 10. Bradley



We're talking about basketball, right???


----------



## TreeTop

The best example of one game making a major difference is...the 2011-2012 Season.  We lost our last regular season game of the year vs Creighton, put us at 8-10 in conference play and an 8th place finish.  Had we won, we would have been 9-9 and in 3rd place in conference play (as we owned the tiebreaker vs all other 9-9 teams)...

http://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2012/conference/Missouri Valley


----------



## sycamorebacker

BrokerZ said:


> We're talking about basketball, right???



Maybe he's our team doctor or he's going to deflate our balls.


----------



## BrokerZ

More WSU marketing material...er...another MVC preview.  This time from NBC Sports (a.k.a. Bleacher Report).  This one is a little better than the CBS write-up; although, the Drake love is a little strange.

http://collegebasketball.nbcsports.com/2015/10/19/missouri-valley-preview-wichita-state-once-again-in-the-drivers-seat/


----------



## sycamore tuff

BrokerZ said:


> We're talking about basketball, right???



I have a computer program that makes these picks for me.  List in reverse alphabetical order.  I thought it was funny when I did it and might get a few responses wondering if I had lost my mind.  The answer to that question is yes.  A long time ago.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

sycamore tuff said:


> I have a computer program that makes these picks for me.  List in reverse alphabetical order.  I thought it was funny when I did it and might get a few responses wondering if I had lost my mind.  The answer to that question is yes.  A long time ago.



That Microsoft Office paperclip is such a joker!


----------



## sycamore tuff

Jason Svoboda said:


> That Microsoft Office paperclip is such a joker!



Jason, I haven't laughed so hard in a long time.  I had tears coming out.  I forgot all about that little paper clip guy.


----------



## TreeTop

Please remind me when the MVC basketball Media Day is.

Thanks!


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

Quabachi said:


> Please remind me when the MVC basketball Media Day is.
> 
> Thanks!


October 27th I believe.


----------



## TreeTop

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mvcbasketballtipoff/#.Vi5h4CveKUn


----------



## Jason Svoboda

sycamore tuff said:


> Jason, I haven't laughed so hard in a long time.  I had tears coming out.  I forgot all about that little paper clip guy.



It truly was the worst. Glad you got a kick out of it.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Quabachi said:


> Please remind me when the MVC basketball Media Day is.
> 
> Thanks!



Jake Odum first team you think? Maybe Leitnaker for all newcomer?


----------



## skdent1414

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-bas...r-make-wichita-state-missouri-valley-favorite

ESPN's Valley preview, may only be able to read if you are an Insider so I'll give you the scoop.

Favorite: Wichita State
Sleeper: Evansville
Team that could fall flat on face: Illinois State
Top Pro Prospect: Ron Baker

Projected All-Valley 1st team
-Baker
-Van Vleet
-Balentine
-Mockevicius
-*Brenton Scott**


----------



## Bluethunder

I would vote Akoon Purcell as the best pro prospect, but since most national organizations don't really dig too deep into the Valley it is probably easier to just pick a wichita state player.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

Bluethunder said:


> I would vote Akoon Purcell as the best pro prospect, but since most national organizations don't really dig too deep into the Valley it is probably easier to just pick a wichita state player.


I would pick Brown as the best Pro Prospect


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Elder Tracy D. Smith said:


> I would pick Brown as the best Pro Prospect



At least your not bias.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

I guess you noticed that. LOL


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Elder Tracy D. Smith said:


> I guess you noticed that. LOL



I'm slow... Took me awhile to pick up on it but I finally did. 

Maybe I missed something from above but I've not the slightst idea how we got on this topic in the first place, but since we are. If he wants to play at the next level he will certainly get that opportunity. We have had many lesser players than him play professionally. I would think his game would translate well internationally. A lot of those international players have a similar hard nosed and fear nothing style that Brown posses. That being said, I don't believe for a minute he is the best pro prospect in the MVC, I'd put several players before him actually.


----------



## Elder Tracy D. Smith

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> I'm slow... Took me awhile to pick up on it but I finally did.


Lol [emoji56] [emoji3]


----------



## ISU_TREE_FAN

Devonte should have no problem playing pro overseas and making pretty good money for playing his game. The NBA............no not likely for him or even for one of the hotshots from Wichita, etc.  The Valley is a tough college league but is definitely not an "NBA feeder league".  And the so-called NBA Development League pays barely enough to get by on.


----------



## BrokerZ

Bluethunder said:


> I would vote Akoon Purcell as the best pro prospect, but since most national organizations don't really dig too deep into the Valley it is probably easier to just pick a wichita state player.



The NBA tends to focus on pure talent and tools rather than collegiate production, so you may be right with Akoon-Purcell.  Me, I'd go with Milton Doyle.  Most talented player in the Valley, IMO.


----------



## BrokerZ

Here's another MVC preview, this time from the WSU beat writer in Wichita.  These are starting to all have a similar theme: 1) WSU is clearly the best team in the league; 2) UNI, Illinois State, Loyola, EU and Indiana State in some order should all finish between 2-6; 3) the bottom of the Valley is putrid.

http://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/article42257919.html

Pretty decent praise for the Sycamores included...


----------



## Gotta Hav

Here's a preview of upcoming MVC games over the Holidays.

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/schedule/#.VnxO5_5On

As it has been all year, lotsa games on ESPN3, ESPNU, etc.


----------

