# More on Rick Heller...



## Jason Svoboda

*CAREER RECORD*

*Year School W-L-T Pct.*
1988 Upper Iowa 7-30 .189
1989 Upper Iowa 10-23 .303
1990 Upper Iowa 19-17 .527
1991 Upper Iowa 22-13 .629
1992 Upper Iowa 23-16 .590
1993 Upper Iowa 21-15-1 .581
1994 Upper Iowa 21-18-1 .538
1995 Upper Iowa 31-13 .705
1996 Upper Iowa 39-12 .765
1997 Upper Iowa 30-14 .682
1998 Upper Iowa 38-8 .826
1999 Upper Iowa 30-15-1 .663
2000 UNI 23-33 .411
*2001 UNI 35-28 .556*
*2002 UNI 30-25-1 .545*
2003 UNI 27-28 .491
2004 UNI 25-31 .446
2005 UNI 26-28 .481
*2006 UNI 28-27 .509*
2007 UNI 23-28 .450
*2008 UNI 30-24 .556*
2009 UNI 23-26 .470

*HISTORY AT UNI*

2000: Hired at UNI ... Became first UNI baseball coach since 1925 to win first game ... Notched school’s 1,000th all-time win... Two wins over #15 Creighton ... Set UNI record for most wins by a first-year coach.

2001: Led UNI to fi rst NCAA bid since 1968 after winning MVC Tournament ... Coached first team All-American Ryan Brunner to MVC Player of the Year honors and second team All-American Nic Ungs to MVC Pitcher of the Year honors ... Three players drafted in first 18 rounds... Led team to school-record 35 wins as it broke eight offensive single-season records ... Swept first-place Missouri State on the road ... Led the MVC in hitting, 10th nationally.

2002: His second 30-win season since arriving at UNI ...Three players drafted ... Back-to-back winning seasons for the first time in 15 years ... Eight batters hit over .300 ... Earned their second consecutive trip to the MVC Tournament.

2003: Finished fourth in the MVC ... Earned his 100th victory as a UNI coach and number 400 of his career … Earned third straight trip to the MVC Tournament ... Adam Boeve named MVC Player of the Year and drafted in the 12th round ...Went 27-28 and 16-15 MVC ... Iowa High School Coaches Association Four-Year College Coach of the Year.

2004: Finished tied for fifth in the MVC ... Pitchers combined for a 4.72 ERA, UNI’s best since 1981 when it turned Division I ... Second straight season UNI had a fielding percentage of .964, second highest in school history ... Swept Big Ten opponents, defeating Iowa three times and Minnesota twice.

2005: Three players named all-conference selections … Kory Kelchen broke the school record for career innings pitched with 274.1 and Bryan Westphal set the UNI single-season record for appearances on the mound with 25 … Panthers won second annual Corridor Classic against Iowa 9-7.

2006: Recorded a 28-27 winning season … Defeated Iowa for the third consecutive time in the Corridor Classic … Defeated No. 5-ranked Nebraska in Lincoln … Recorded UNI’s lowest earned run average since joining Div. 1.

2007: Four all-MVC selections … Aaron Jenkins set the single-season strike out record, and tied the career mark … Earned 200th win as UNI’s head coach … Earned 500th career win as a head coach … named to Iowa High School Coaches Association Hall of Fame. 

2008: Seven all-MVC selections, including MVC Player of the Year, Brandon Douglas ... Douglas also earned All-America honors ... recorded UNI’s third 30-win season ... Nick Kirk tossed the school’s fifth no-hitter ... Iowa High School Coaches Association Four-Year College Coach of the Year.


----------



## SycamoreinTexas

HAHAH 4 winning seasons at UNI.HAH ONLY 4! AND WE HIRE THIS GUY TO KEEP THE SYCAMORES UP TOP? WOW. NOT ROCKET SCIENCE


----------



## Jason Svoboda

sycamores28 said:


> HAHAH 4 winning seasons at UNI.HAH ONLY 4! AND WE HIRE THIS GUY TO KEEP THE SYCAMORES UP TOP? WOW. NOT ROCKET SCIENCE


I honestly don't think wins and losses solely paint the picture here. Do you know what he was up against at UNI?


----------



## Lights Out

Why is it so hard for people to realize that Mitch Hannahs is not the best person for the job?  Didn't he leave ISU? No offense to JUCO baseball, but what exactly has he done at Lincoln Trail?  Ask anyone who has played baseball in the Valley and they will tell you that Heller is a great coach.  I think some people need to wakeup and realize that RP hired the best person for the job!


----------



## SycamoreinTexas

Well I dont really know what he was up against.  But honestly was Delmonico a finalsit for the job or not?


----------



## Lights Out

Hopefully not Delmonico is bumbling fool.  I could tell you story after story about him at Tenn.  It is best we didn't bring his traveling gong show to Terre Haute.


----------



## millwood

Jason Svoboda said:


> *CAREER RECORD*
> 
> *Year School W-L-T Pct.*
> 1988 Upper Iowa 7-30 .189
> 1989 Upper Iowa 10-23 .303
> 1990 Upper Iowa 19-17 .527
> 1991 Upper Iowa 22-13 .629
> 1992 Upper Iowa 23-16 .590
> 1993 Upper Iowa 21-15-1 .581
> 1994 Upper Iowa 21-18-1 .538
> 1995 Upper Iowa 31-13 .705
> 1996 Upper Iowa 39-12 .765
> 1997 Upper Iowa 30-14 .682
> 1998 Upper Iowa 38-8 .826
> 1999 Upper Iowa 30-15-1 .663
> 2000 UNI 23-33 .411
> *2001 UNI 35-28 .556*
> *2002 UNI 30-25-1 .545*
> 2003 UNI 27-28 .491
> 2004 UNI 25-31 .446
> 2005 UNI 26-28 .481
> *2006 UNI 28-27 .509*
> 2007 UNI 23-28 .450
> *2008 UNI 30-24 .556*
> 2009 UNI 23-26 .470
> 
> *HISTORY AT UNI*
> 
> 2000: Hired at UNI ... Became first UNI baseball coach since 1925 to win first game ... Notched school’s 1,000th all-time win... Two wins over #15 Creighton ... Set UNI record for most wins by a first-year coach.
> 
> 2001: Led UNI to fi rst NCAA bid since 1968 after winning MVC Tournament ... Coached first team All-American Ryan Brunner to MVC Player of the Year honors and second team All-American Nic Ungs to MVC Pitcher of the Year honors ... Three players drafted in first 18 rounds... Led team to school-record 35 wins as it broke eight offensive single-season records ... Swept first-place Missouri State on the road ... Led the MVC in hitting, 10th nationally.
> 
> 2002: His second 30-win season since arriving at UNI ...Three players drafted ... Back-to-back winning seasons for the first time in 15 years ... Eight batters hit over .300 ... Earned their second consecutive trip to the MVC Tournament.
> 
> 2003: Finished fourth in the MVC ... Earned his 100th victory as a UNI coach and number 400 of his career … Earned third straight trip to the MVC Tournament ... Adam Boeve named MVC Player of the Year and drafted in the 12th round ...Went 27-28 and 16-15 MVC ... Iowa High School Coaches Association Four-Year College Coach of the Year.
> 
> 2004: Finished tied for fifth in the MVC ... Pitchers combined for a 4.72 ERA, UNI’s best since 1981 when it turned Division I ... Second straight season UNI had a fielding percentage of .964, second highest in school history ... Swept Big Ten opponents, defeating Iowa three times and Minnesota twice.
> 
> 2005: Three players named all-conference selections … Kory Kelchen broke the school record for career innings pitched with 274.1 and Bryan Westphal set the UNI single-season record for appearances on the mound with 25 … Panthers won second annual Corridor Classic against Iowa 9-7.
> 
> 2006: Recorded a 28-27 winning season … Defeated Iowa for the third consecutive time in the Corridor Classic … Defeated No. 5-ranked Nebraska in Lincoln … Recorded UNI’s lowest earned run average since joining Div. 1.
> 
> 2007: Four all-MVC selections … Aaron Jenkins set the single-season strike out record, and tied the career mark … Earned 200th win as UNI’s head coach … Earned 500th career win as a head coach … named to Iowa High School Coaches Association Hall of Fame.
> 
> 2008: Seven all-MVC selections, including MVC Player of the Year, Brandon Douglas ... Douglas also earned All-America honors ... recorded UNI’s third 30-win season ... Nick Kirk tossed the school’s fifth no-hitter ... Iowa High School Coaches Association Four-Year College Coach of the Year.


WOW! THE LAST TEN SEASONS AT 500. Man I,m exited now, I love finishing every season a game or two over or under 500 . This guy has it down to an art form. I wonder if he loves to kiss his sister too?


----------



## rgd

Lights Out:

Just admit that your boy Prettyman screwed this one up like he did the last one.  Now, instead of JUCO transfers from California, we are going to get them from Iowa.  What ties does Heller have to Indiana State?  To recruiting in Indiana?  To getting more money for the new field?  Mitch had a facility built with 4 batting cages, 2 mounds and a work out center built at Lincoln Trail Jr. College.  Just imagine what he could have done at ISU.  I thing Prettyman thinks there is an L instead of an I in front of SU.


----------



## SycamoreinTexas

Well at indiana state, it's ok to finish above or just below .500.


----------



## TJames

*hey lights....*

mitch hannahs left indiana state to become the head coach at lincoln trail....he wanted to be a head coach...and at that time, there was no sign of when bob warn was going to retire...

as for the concept that some people keep trying to pass that junior collge coaching is different than coaching on the division I level, i distinctly remember a guy who went from junior college head coaching who became the head coach at mississipi state....his name was ron polk...and he had a lot of success at mississippi state....and i am sure that there are others than i havent even thought of yet...who have gone from the junior college ranks to division I coaching in a lot of sports.....

and, in a final few words about this whole episode, i am sad for mitch hannahs....a great alumnus of indiana state....who has had his dream crushed twice in three years.....i doubt if he'll offer it up again a third time....

maybe mitch will go to another division I school in the future and prove to one and all, finally, that he deserves his shot.....i just hope that he doesn't come back and face indiana state as a head coach.....

i dont understand it....guess i never will...i just hope that the powers that be made the right choice.....to be a finalist twice...and doesn't get the job either time....at his own school....i just don't get it.....


----------



## millwood

*Wow the Art of the 500 season. That excitiing.*



millwood said:


> WOW! THE LAST TEN SEASONS AT 500. Man I,m exited now, I love finishing every season a game or two over or under 500 . Heller has it down to an art form. I wonder if he loves to kiss his sister too? Do you know what he has to work with at UNI some ask? do you know what Hannahs has to work with at Lincoln Trail compared to John Logan and some of the other programs in that league? He wins titles, championships and respect. The other day some one posted that he isn't a proven D1 coach. CAN THEY TELL ME THE D1 TEAM MEGGS COACHED BEFORE ISU ? CAN YOU SAY DII ?


----------



## Lights Out

I realize you must be a close personal friend of Mitch's and that is fine.  You are a little biased in your assessment.  I like the fact that Heller has been a Head Coach in the Valley and knows the conference and has won in the conference.  So what if Mitch is from ISU.  Heller is flat out a better coach.  JUCO ball to D 1 is a different league.  I'll admit I wanted Hannahs the first time, but now I think RP made the right choice.


----------



## jno2879

How do you know if a guy like Mitch can succed if he never gets the shot? Hellers id a 500 coach, oh boy thats exciting!


----------



## SycamoreinTexas

hah Heller won once in the league and obvioulsy it was pure luck because he never did sh*t after 2001 in the missouri valley... I think Hannahs had more guy get drafted than Heller did


----------



## Lights Out

You don't know for sure, but look at it this way. Would anyother D1 school in the country hire Hannahs to be their Head Coach?  I think we have way too much bias on the board to look at this objectively.


----------



## millwood

Lights Out said:


> Why is it so hard for people to realize that Mitch Hannahs is not the best person for the job?  Didn't he leave ISU? No offense to JUCO baseball, but what exactly has he done at Lincoln Trail?  Ask anyone who has played baseball in the Valley and they will tell you that Heller is a great coach.  I think some people need to wakeup and realize that RP hired the best person for the job!


What has he don at LTCC ? in the last 5 years, He's won  2 Conf Titles, 2 regionals, and finishes near the top af the pack evry year. He does't practice the art of the 500 season as Heller does, thats for sure.


----------



## TJames

*just hope isu doesn't live to regret this decision*

like i said earlier....and see mitch come back and beat isu as the head coach of another school....

this reminds me of when iu hired gerry dinardo as football coach...and passed up on a young up-and-comer by the name of urban meyer....the reason...well, it seems that gerry had more experience as a division I head coach....boy that really worked well, now didn't it....lol....

and why do i feel like i am batting my head against the wall.....i keep giving examples of juco coaches who went to division I baseball (and other sports) and have succeeded...but yet...the same line keep coming up..."coaching juco is different than coaching division I"....jeez......


----------



## SycamoreinTexas

Well, we could all sit here and bitch and moan about the new coach but just deal with it that Heller is the new coach.  He needs the support of the community too so just get over it.  If you dont like it then dont come and watch or support the team.


----------



## millwood

Lights Out said:


> I realize you must be a close personal friend of Mitch's and that is fine.  You are a little biased in your assessment.  I like the fact that Heller has been a Head Coach in the Valley and knows the conference and has won in the conference.  So what if Mitch is from ISU.  Heller is flat out a better coach.  JUCO ball to D 1 is a different league.  I'll admit I wanted Hannahs the first time, but now I think RP made the right choice.


If JUCO is so much different then D1 ball and can't be trusted as a proven test, then why did every player Exept Ciolli and Straus. that contributed in a big way to the 09 season come from a JUCO?   Explain that one. By the way I talked to Mitch Hannahs one time in my life. So you realize nothing about me being a close personal friend,


----------



## millwood

sycamores28 said:


> Well, we could all sit here and bitch and moan about the new coach but just deal with it that Heller is the new coach.  He needs the support of the community too so just get over it.  If you dont like it then dont come and watch or support the team.


I'll support Heller a 100 times faster then I'll  ever support RP again and there is a ton of us.


----------



## millwood

Lights Out said:


> You don't know for sure, but look at it this way. Would anyother D1 school in the country hire Hannahs to be their Head Coach?  I think we have way too much bias on the board to look at this objectively.


RP better get on his knees every night and pray another D1 doesn't hire Hannahs anytime soon, because we will look real stupid, real fast, he's that good and the people that know about him, know exactly what I'm saying.


----------



## millwood

millwood said:


> If JUCO is so much different then D1 ball and can't be trusted as a proven test, then why did every player Exept Ciolli and Straus. that contributed in a big way to the 09 season come from a JUCO?   Explain that one. By the way I talked to Mitch Hannahs one time in my life. So you realize nothing about me being a close personal friend,


Wow thanks for pointing out the difference between Coaching Juco Players and D1 guys. Sure  Hannahs Might have  known how to coach the 18 Juco transfers from the 09 team who generated 80 percent of the offense and represented 90 percent of the innings pitched, but might have been lost with the rest of the D1 players. He could have made huge mistakes, like not realizing that Joe Meggs was as good or better then Brian Jett at 1st base. Hannas probably never even played D1 ball. Oh wait thats right he was one of the best to ever put on a Sycamores Uniform. NEVERMIND.


----------



## bent20

Let's get off the Hannahs debate. There's too much "he's that good," "no he's not" going on. He's one of our own and I support him, but I also like this hire. You look at what Heller did at UNI (think about all of the obstacles there) and you should be impressed.


----------



## TJames

*hate to say it...but this "hannahs debate"*

may hang over the program for awhile.....any misstep....any losing streak....any inconsistency of play....if the program isn't solidly among the mvc's best....within the next couple of years.....and its going to come up again.....and again......

is that fair to coach heller? no it isn't...but unfortunately that's the way it is......

i will do this, however...if coach heller and his coaching staff...once put in place....would like a middle man with the isu baseball alumni community....let me know......and i would try to help as best as i can......


----------



## rgd

TJames:

No fault of Heller's, but he is going to need all of the support he can get with the alumni.  He is walking straight into a mine field and has no clue where they are.


----------



## TJames

*i just hope.....that former isu players.....*

aren't being minimized by school officials. there was very good baseball played at indiana state well before coach meggs and coach heller. and there will be good baseball after coach meggs and coach heller. 

we had outstanding teams and outstanding players during the bob warn era. and any attempt to act as if those years didnt occur, including a trip to the college world series in 1986, just isnt going to happen.

we are proud of the fact that indiana state is one of the two indiana colleges to have played in the college world series. to us, it's a big deal. its something to hang your hat on. purdue, iu, butler and ball state can't say that. only notre dame has been to the college world series since isu went. and that's it.

it would be like hiring a new men's basketball coach and acting as the 1978-79 season never happened....and that larry bird doesn't matter.....as a matter of fact, that sounds a little like seth davis' book now doesn't it....lol.....


----------



## Sackalot

rgd said:


> Lights Out:
> 
> Just admit that your boy Prettyman screwed this one up like he did the last one.  Now, instead of JUCO transfers from California, we are going to get them from Iowa.  What ties does Heller have to Indiana State?  To recruiting in Indiana?  To getting more money for the new field?  Mitch had a facility built with 4 batting cages, 2 mounds and a work out center built at Lincoln Trail Jr. College.  Just imagine what he could have done at ISU.  I thing Prettyman thinks there is an L instead of an I in front of SU.



Are you really making a big deal out of a "new" facility at Lincoln Trail, which had to build a field because they didn't have a decent one at all?  That wasn't built because of a person/coach it was built because they had to, he might have helped raise the money, but it would have been raised anyway.  And JUCO transfers from Cali..come on, not realistic, it is much more realistic to think that we could get transfers from Iowa (move from really cold to less cold).  I understand that many on here are upset that Hannah didn't get the job...but as I have said before on this page, Athletics at ISU is under Student Affairs.  This is different than many other schools many of you like to compare ISU too.  Because it is under Student Affairs and not its own entity there is a higher level of bureaucracy.  That higher level of bureaucracy leads to differing needs and requirements.  Prettyman has the ultimate say but due to the structure of the administration others also have a dog in the fight.  This makes a difference within any hiring process and though many like to think that Athletics is its own little world on campus it is not structurally that way at ISU.

Regardless, Heller was hired because Prettyman and the administratin felt he was the best man for the job.  Like it or not.  Heller will help raise money and the scope of the baseball program. Will he do it exactly the way that some would do it, of course not.  But, just because he was just over .500 doesn't necessarily mean the death of all things baseball at ISU.  I am certain of one thing...if he comes in and starts winning most will jump on the bandwagon and if he loses everyone will say "I told you so".


----------



## Jason Svoboda

TJames said:


> may hang over the program for awhile.....any misstep....any losing streak....any inconsistency of play....if the program isn't solidly among the mvc's best....within the next couple of years.....and its going to come up again.....and again......
> 
> is that fair to coach heller? no it isn't...but unfortunately that's the way it is......
> 
> i will do this, however...if coach heller and his coaching staff...once put in place....would like a middle man with the isu baseball alumni community....let me know......and i would try to help as best as i can......


And people need to grow the hell up. That's also the way it is.

Kid: I want a McDonald's Happy Meal
Mom: No, we're having dinner at home
Kid: But, but, but... I want it!
Mom: No!
Kid: Waaaaaahhh Waaaaaaaaaah!

Seriously. We understand that people may not like the hire. However, to suggest that folks will be throwing this up in Prettyman's or Heller's face at any time of trouble is absolutely childish. Heller needs SUPPORT, not back stabbing and there will be some bumps in the road while he tries to implement his vision of Sycamore baseball.


----------



## TJames

*ok....yep..its childish.....yep...its not right.....*

but this is college athletics....where people throw all sorts of stuff against the wall....heck, people are still blaming bill hodges for stuff that happened with isu basketball in the late 1970s....lol....is that fair?...no......but it happens....and i've seen stabs at other former coaches on here as well.....as well as current coaches....its part of the landscape unforunately.....

i was just stating a fact.....not hoping that it happens...dont want it to happen...but mark my words....it will happen......


----------



## SycamoreSage

*One Heller Connection to Indiana State*

Heller does have a connection to Indiana State. His daughter -- an All-State Iowa softball player --signed a national letter of intent to play at Indiana State. Unfortunately, she decided to move to Europe with a friend rather than enroll in college.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

TJames said:


> but this is college athletics....where people throw all sorts of stuff against the wall....heck, people are still blaming bill hodges for stuff that happened with isu basketball in the late 1970s....lol....is that fair?...no......but it happens....and i've seen stabs at other former coaches on here as well.....as well as current coaches....its part of the landscape unforunately.....
> 
> i was just stating a fact.....not hoping that it happens...dont want it to happen...but mark my words....it will happen......


Understood.

I just hope those folks are front and center to take their portion of the blame if the program doesn't get off the ground because they will have likely have as big of a hand in it as Prettyman, Heller, et al.

Baseball alumni should be on the horn as soon as possible offering up their services to Heller. Now if he pulls a Meggs and turns his back on them, then that will be an entirely different story. However, everything I've read about Heller states he is very engaging, outgoing and uses the resources at his disposal to the fullest.


----------



## rgd

Jason:

Is it not true that when the budget passed for the new baseball stadium, they had to cut some money?  Supposedly, during the trimming process, the new batting cages that were included in the master plan, were cut out.  Now, who would have an easier time soliciting funds in the community for these batting cages?  Who would have an easier time getting money donated from the alumni?  Of course both are rhetorical questions and you know the answer.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

rgd said:


> Jason:
> 
> Is it not true that when the budget passed for the new baseball stadium, they had to cut some money? Supposedly, during the trimming process, the new batting cages that were included in the master plan, were cut out. Now, who would have an easier time soliciting funds in the community for these batting cages? Who would have an easier time getting money donated from the alumni? Of course both are rhetorical questions and you know the answer.


Yep, that is what we've been hearing. That said, I would hope it wouldn't matter who the coach is, that folks would be willing to give back to their alma mater. 

There were a ton of decisions made while I was a student that I didn't support. Some impacted organizations I was a part of on campus and that I still hold very dear to me. However, I didn't shun off the administration or turn my back on Indiana State because I didn't get my way. It's becoming more obvious to me with every post that many folks here have very little loyalty to Indiana State.

All I can hope for is people take a look at the big picture here. After Heller has come and gone, Prettyman has come and gone, I hope Indiana State still has a thriving baseball program that the future AD and coach can continue to build on. It's up to the baseball alumni, fans and supporters to play a big role in that, not for the good of an individual, but for the good of the program and our University.


----------



## TJames

*one last point jason....*

loyalty is a two-way street....it must be earned on both sides......if you are disloyal to alums and former players, then dont expect a lot of loyalty in return.....


----------



## Jason Svoboda

TJames said:


> loyalty is a two-way street....it must be earned on both sides......if you are disloyal to alums and former players, then dont expect a lot of loyalty in return.....


The University isn't disloyal to anyone, Tom. You don't have to be loyal to Ron Prettyman (since that seems to be where most of the anger is being directed) but you most certainly should do whatever you can for Heller (if he reaches out) and Indiana State.


----------



## TJames

*jason...isu HAS been disloyal to its former athletes....*

over the years...its been a major complaint for i dont know how long.....people were complaining about it back when i worked in the athletic department...i used to have a special mailing that i put together myself...for former athletes....because nothing was never being done officially for them...people who live in all sections of the country.....who wanted to keep tabs on what's going on in their particular former sport....

i hear it all the time...former athletes say that they never hear anything from isu...until its fundraising time...then the letters and the phone calls come....and then when fundraising is over...its nothing again...until the next year....they sure know how to find people when they want money...lol.....otherwise,  its nothing.....

why do you think the football alumni group that i have put together has grown by leaps and bounds over the last year and a half....i hear their stories all the time....have heard it from former baseball players, basketball players, track people...all across the board.....if i didnt send them stuff, they wouldnt know what the heck was going on.....

its better now than it has been in some respects...but there still needs to be a much better outreach from isu's athletic department to former athletes....


----------



## BankShot

Right on, Tom Dawg! I like the use of the term, "Outreach." Yes, ISU Athletics needs an "Outreach Coordinator." Yuz da man!


----------



## TJames

*glad somebody thinks so....lol....*

maybe i am old-school...i believe in loyalty to an athletic program...and an athletic program's loyalty to its former athletes.....as i said...loyalty is a two-way street....

dont come begging for money from me....if you aren't interested in me at any other time.....if i hear that comment once from former athletes, i hear it 100 times....

heck, that's one of the reasons larry bird has been so hot and cold when it comes to isu....it seems as if the only times that they want him for anything...is to give money....and then we all wonder why is he so standoffish....

there are so many other things that former athletes can give to help out their old programs...other than money...like their time....their interest.....their support...helping out when needed (other than being treated like am atm machine).....


----------



## millwood

bent20 said:


> Let's get off the Hannahs debate. There's too much "he's that good," "no he's not" going on. He's one of our own and I support him, but I also like this hire. You look at what Heller did at UNI (think about all of the obstacles there) and you should be impressed.


Look at what Heller was up against at UNI ? He had a great Stadium, Alot more people in the seats for every game then we do and competed with only 1 other D1 program in the State of Iowa. Indiana Has 9 D1 Baseball Programs that competes for it's  players. As far as getting off the Hannahs thing, feel free if you wish, there's no reason tell others what to post, What next ? should we head to the library and burn a few books?


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Tom, Indiana State University can not be disloyal -- it isn't a person. It does not make decisions. The folks that were hired make them. Those folks can be disloyal to alumni. It's pretty black and white.

Anyhow, I still never got my question answered in the other thread regarding alumni involvement. Was there a reason you dodged it twice? Warn went out in 2007, so what was the excuse to the piss poor support prior? Was it on Warn or the baseball alumni?

Better yet, let's put our money (so to speak) where the mouth is. I know Rick Heller has read and reads these forums. I also know that Ron Prettyman as well as many members of the Indiana State University athletics department does as well. I'm going to create a thread allowing baseball alumni to openly post their interest in donating time and resources in getting Indiana State baseball back to the elite level it was in the 80s.


----------



## TJames

*havent dodged....i sent you an email from a former player illustrating my point*

The support for ISU baseball was pretty good during Bob's time at Indiana State. Things started to slip his last few years in the program. You can be at one place too long. Bob  just ran out of steam. He was a very good coach. But his personality was brusk at times. The loyalty was there, though. We had former players coming back, guys who were in the major leagues, coming back and working with the ISU team. We had ex-players who were out of professional baseball coming back, doing the same thing. 

Yes, there were a few guys who had personality clashes with Bob and didn't come back quite as much. But they still had loyalty to the program generally and would come back on occasion. But on the whole, the loyalty from former players to the baseball program was good then. They were welcomed at practice, invited to meet and mingle with the isu players.


----------



## IndyTreeFan

TJames said:


> over the years...its been a major complaint for i dont know how long.....people were complaining about it back when i worked in the athletic department...i used to have a special mailing that i put together myself...for former athletes....because nothing was never being done officially for them...people who live in all sections of the country.....who wanted to keep tabs on what's going on in their particular former sport....
> 
> i hear it all the time...former athletes say that they never hear anything from isu...until its fundraising time...then the letters and the phone calls come....and then when fundraising is over...its nothing again...until the next year....they sure know how to find people when they want money...lol.....otherwise,  its nothing.....
> 
> why do you think the football alumni group that i have put together has grown by leaps and bounds over the last year and a half....i hear their stories all the time....have heard it from former baseball players, basketball players, track people...all across the board.....if i didnt send them stuff, they wouldnt know what the heck was going on.....
> 
> its better now than it has been in some respects...but there still needs to be a much better outreach from isu's athletic department to former athletes....



From Webster's II New Riverside University Dictionary:

     disloyal:  Being untrue to duty or obligation

What duty or obligation does Indiana State owe to any of its graduates?  Most of us paid for our education there (many of the people you are defending, Tom, did not), and we got a quality education in return for our money.  We also received a great many growth opportunities and fantastic memories and lifetime friends made.  Because of the enormous benefits that we received from Indiana State, most alums don't feel the need to be coddled by the University, nor do we expect them to spend a bunch of time contacting us so we can feel more important.  We are more than happy to contribute time or money when the opportunity arises, regardless of how often our old professors or deans reach out to us.  Personally, I've found that when I've reached out to ISU, they have been more than willing (and usually are quite thrilled) to talk about the school, what's happening, and if I offer to help, after the person gets up off the floor, they are very happy for the help.

Now, I'm talking about things like helping with recruitment of students, giving of my time to record a segment for a video, or just getting people together to help distribute things.  I don't expect the College of Business to listen to me when it comes to hiring a new dean, or when the Insurance and Risk Management Department needed a new chairman.  If I have ideas, I'll contact them, but although I'm in the industry, I'll give the people who do this for a living the benefit of the doubt that they know what they're doing.  And I don't feel slighted if I offer up candidates and they don't end up getting the job.  My opinion is no more important than any other grad.  But, then again, I'm not an athlete...

If you're an athlete and you're wanting to know what's going on with your sport, why not form your own group of alums?  If you're that interested...

I'm getting tired of hearing about how the University does so little for former athletes.  Geez, take the initiative as a former athlete (or any type of alum for pity sake) and contact the school to see how you can help.  Stop complaining because they haven't called you.  That's life.  I'm sure after reading all this crap that if I were the coach, I'd be scared to death to contact former players for fear of getting a royal arse-chewing and wasting my time!

Vent completed, we now return you to your local programming...


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Tom, check your PMs. I have an idea.


----------



## 4Q_iu

*I'm fuzzy...*

Tom,

Let's imagine that I am a former Sycamore athlete; I now live in the greater ATL, GA area and because of job / family / distance, I can't attend home games, other than $$$, how can I provide interest / support?

In today's 24/7 high-tech communications world; I have the Trib-Star at my fingertips, I have GoSycamores.com, I have this forum -- Sure, State can send me a montly newsletter but I read the 'game notes' for each FBall and MBB game; I could hold season tix but if I don't live locally, how is that any different than just sending cash?

I agree w/ you -- State has never done a good job of working alumni relations (John Newton is the exception - but he's one person) but I think I'm missing the point of what your're trying to say.


----------



## TJames

*its called the personal touch.....*

athletes...and alums...want to be shown that they are wanted.....desired...to help.....if the coach isn't the one that they played for....then they are a little more reticient to keep in contact what what is going on in their sport....

i just find it interesting....i have seen major, and some not so major (like rose-hulman down the road from ISU) schools who do a great job of outreach to their former athletes. former athletes are treated at those schools like they mattered, their efforts counted for something, they were appreciated..and not hear...well, you got a free education and that's enough...so quit whining....lol.....

yes, they can read black and white websites...or newspapers......but as former athletes, they want to know what's going on with their respective programs...the inside stuff.....things that you can't get in the paper...or online.....

that's what i give the football alumni with my newsletter..updates on former coaches.....deaths among former players....who got a new job....family tidbits.....i include all that kind of stuff in my newsletters.....maybe they dont know anybody at the college anymore...they want to help out but they don't know who to contact....they need a go-between...that's been me in terms of football...and more recently....baseball.....

i have brought guys back together...ex-teammates...who havent talked in 20 years or more.....and now they're making plans to attend games together as groups.....that is what i am talking about.....


----------



## 4Q_iu

*Got it...*

Thanks!

Again, I've got many stories of my days at State; some good, some bad; 

would I attend again? -- hard question for me to answer; several advantages but hard for me to answer


----------



## SycamoreFan317

TJames said:


> over the years...its been a major complaint for i dont know how long.....people were complaining about it back when i worked in the athletic department...i used to have a special mailing that i put together myself...for former athletes....because nothing was never being done officially for them...people who live in all sections of the country.....who wanted to keep tabs on what's going on in their particular former sport....
> 
> i hear it all the time...former athletes say that they never hear anything from isu...until its fundraising time...then the letters and the phone calls come....and then when fundraising is over...its nothing again...until the next year....they sure know how to find people when they want money...lol.....otherwise,  its nothing.....
> 
> why do you think the football alumni group that i have put together has grown by leaps and bounds over the last year and a half....i hear their stories all the time....have heard it from former baseball players, basketball players, track people...all across the board.....if i didnt send them stuff, they wouldnt know what the heck was going on.....
> 
> its better now than it has been in some respects...but there still needs to be a much better outreach from isu's athletic department to former athletes....



Tom, this is true for all alumni.......not just athletics. ISU has done a terrible staying in touch with the alumni I think we all agree on that. Most, not all, were given a part if not all of their education for free.........shouldn't they reach out to ISU in return.


----------



## TJames

*317...*

a lot of them have...and have been ignored...and rebuffed....


----------



## TROCK24

Tom, I am on the same page as you.  They made a bad choice and in three years we will see.  I played for Coach Hannahs and he was not only a great coach but also a great person.  I learned so much from Coach Hannahs.  It was not just about baseball but life in general.  Maybe one day Coach Hannahs will play the Sycamores and I will just sit back and smile when he leaves Bob Warn Field with a victory.  Dont get me wrong I love ISU.  I have been a season ticket holder for men's basketball for 10 years and went to Memphis when Renn and Menser upset Oklahoma in the tourney.  Coach Hannahs was the right man for the job but sadly they went in another direction for a second time.  I am finished with this subject and will continue to support ISU athletics but sometimes things just don't make much sense.   Travis Mason #24  (1992-1996 Baseball Alum   1995 MVC Tourney Champs. last team to do so and Coach Hannahs was part of that team)  Go Sycamores


----------



## BankShot

That, my Sycamore friends, is a perfect recitation of the concept of "loyalty.":sycamores:


----------



## Chief_Quabachi

If you want loyalty, get a dog.

Loyalty will get your ass fired if you allow it to rule sound logic.

Emotional decisions often are bad decisions.

This is from my perspective as an agency/sales mgr. over a 25 yr. career.

Go Sycamores.......and best wishes to you Coach Heller.


----------



## BankShot

LOL - speaking of "sound logic"...whoever said that Hannah's candidacy was "emotional?" TJ and others have simply presented the facts. If RP NEVER intended to hire Hannahs, he should NOT have brought him back for another interview, three years on the heels of being edged out by his California cohort, Meggs. 

Hannahs is the #1 progeny of one of the GREATEST coaches in ISU history, in a sport revered  nationally alongside "apple pie."  If you think the only support for Hannahs was "emotional," I advise  a trip to your local library,  and the thumbing of few pages in Norman Rockwell's America (Readers Digest, 1975). Baseball...is CULTURE.

That's from a social studies teacher/coach/athletic official since '77...


----------



## Jason Svoboda

BankShot said:


> LOL - speaking of "sound logic"...whoever said that Hannah's candidacy was "emotional?" TJ and others have simply presented the facts. If RP NEVER intended to hire Hannahs, he should NOT have brought him back for another interview, three years on the heels of being edged out by his California cohort, Meggs.
> 
> Hannahs is the #1 progeny of one of the GREATEST coaches in ISU history, in a sport revered nationally alongside "apple pie." If you think the only support for Hannahs was "emotional," I advise a trip to your local library, and the thumbing of few pages in Norman Rockwell's America (Readers Digest). Baseball...is CULTURE.
> 
> That's from a social studies teacher/coach/athletic official since '77...


So are you saying that you believe that Hannah's interview and candidacy this second time around wasn't legit?


----------



## BankShot

Who knows...could've easily been a political maneuver by RP to appease the Hannah's lobby and minimize the fracturing of an ISU fan base.


----------



## Chief_Quabachi

BankShot said:


> LOL - speaking of "sound logic"...whoever said that Hannah's candidacy was "emotional?" TJ and others have simply presented the facts. If RP NEVER intended to hire Hannahs, he should NOT have brought him back for another interview, three years on the heels of being edged out by his California cohort, Meggs.
> 
> Hannahs is the #1 progeny of one of the GREATEST coaches in ISU history, in a sport revered  nationally alongside "apple pie."  If you think the only support for Hannahs was "emotional," I advise  a trip to your local library,  and the thumbing of few pages in Norman Rockwell's America (Readers Digest, 1975). Baseball...is CULTURE.
> 
> That's from a social studies teacher/coach/athletic official since '77...



Not emotional?........you've got to be baiting me with that comment. This whole topic has been rife with emotion to the point I thought some of these weenies were going to cry because Hannahs wasn't hired.

As for referring to Norman Rockwell's America from 1975, that was ions ago and the world is a whole different place. I don't have any data to back this statement, but I would suggest that football, based on attendance at the high school, collegiate and pro level has supplanted baseball as America's sport of choice.

Apple pie and Chevrolet. "I wanna see the USA in my Chevrolet". Where has American car culture gone? NOTHING is like it was in 1975. I sure wish it was.Unfortunately, it isn't.


----------



## TROCK24

Weenies.  My man you are clueless.  Do you know Mitch Hannahs and what kind of person he is.  You have no idea the impact he has had on some of his past players.  You have never played for him and seen the passion he has for the game.  Some of us were upset but to call is out is pretty sad.  Loyalty is something I can say is very important just ask the several players that were loyal to Coach Hannahs and called and emailed Prettyman.  I have my opinion and you have yours. No matter what I love sycamore athletics and will support them.


----------



## BankShot

As long as America continues to be dominated by Christian values, Rockwell's illustrations will timelessly be cherished. Baseball just so happened to be his favorite sport...and offers excellent cultural perspectives thru American history (1894-1978) by virtue of a paint brush. 

Here's a good article which addresses your "popularity" issue of baseball v. football:

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/really-is-baseball-less-popular/ 

As far as actual participation, I'm sure that baseball & SOFTBALL exceed football, especially in lifetime sports. How many adult INDUSTRIAL & RECREATION leagues do you see in football? Same goes for boys & girls youth leagues.

Ya, America's changed since '75...a major cultural values dilution,  which has been primarily aligned with _illegal immigration_. But that's another story, forecast to be on the national political burner again NEXT year.


----------



## IndyTreeFan

When I read people saying that they will smile if the Sycamores lose, I don't believe their pontifications of loyalty.  At least not to ISU...


----------



## BankShot

You don't think there's any redemptive value in "suffering?"


----------



## Jason Svoboda

BankShot said:


> You don't think there's any redemptive value in "suffering?"


Not when it is misplaced.


----------



## BankShot

And you think that all "suffering" is self-controlled?

Suffering only has two purposes; both are constructive. 

(1) To help a suffering individual to return to the right path. [Pain is the megaphone that God uses to assist the deaf in hearing Him.] 

(2) Because God needs our suffering, to be used by virtue of the Communion of Saints, to assist other souls in their redemption. 

When we are facing situation (1), above, we should quickly ask God to help us see what we are blind to in our behavior and to help us correct our erred ways and bring our suffering to an end. This is good. 

If we are facing situation (2), above, *although the physical suffering may be great, there will be an inner joy and peace.* A joy and a peace which only true collaboration with God can bring. This is also good. 

Trock24's inference in the "pleasure" of seeing a Hannahs-coached squad DEFEAT ISU/Heller is most closely aligned to #2 above.


----------



## Beav89

Ok, I really had to fight my urge to post this message late last night because I thought I was just over-reacting due to being tired, but as I continue to slog my way through the continued debate over Hannahs-Heller and how the alums feel slighted, etc, etc, etc, I'm finding myself feeling exactly the same over a night of sleep and a couple of cups of Sunday coffee.  So, here it is...

I enjoy participating on this forum board and I've found the conversation & debate both intelligent and entertaining.  BUT, over the last few days I've also found myself getting tired of the endless crying about this hiring decision.  People are posting that they are accepting this, but then turn around and post again to rehash the same stuff they've professed to have left behind them.  As one of the few women that post here (I suspect), I feel odd telling a bunch of men to GIVE IT A REST AND MOVE ON.  Really.  Like, don't post about it anymore.  It's tiring and makes the ISU fans look devisive and emotionally scorned.

Let's give Heller the support he deserves starting RIGHT NOW.

Ok, end of pissy rant, gentlemen.


----------



## BankShot

Beav,

If you'd been around since '74, you'd probably joined the activity...


----------



## Daveinth

Beav 
Thanks i enjoyed that best post of the year


----------



## SycamoreFan317

BankShot said:


> Beav,
> 
> If you'd been around since '74, you'd probably joined the activity...



I have been around since '74 and she is correct. Bankshot come on, you have been in education long enough to know about the politics, no it does not make it right but that is just the way it is. Even Mitch  came on here and asked people to move on. So why can't the people who say that they support him so much honor his request?


----------



## TreeTop

SycamoreFan317 said:


> Even Mitch  came on here and asked people to move on. So why can't the people who say that they support him so much honor his request?



Exactly.

This debate should no longer be a debate....per the class act Mitch Hannahs.


----------



## TROCK24

No one has posted anything about Coach Hannahs today.  I think we have moved on so all you Prettyman boys can relax I am done posting about it.   And just for future post, if you don't like what I say you do not have to read it. Have a great day and GO STATE.  By thye way, I will support all ISU athletics.  Some of you guys that know it all need to ask around and people will tell you I am one of States biggest fans.


----------



## BankShot

PRETTYman boyz...that's a good one!:bigsmile:

I noted that the shift in poll results favoring Heller occurred AFTER the hiring, likely the byproduct of this very same phenomena.

317, I understand your  compromising "olive branch" position on this matter. Unfortunately, I've never been one that simply opens the door and sweeps "tradition" under a doormat...especially one that took 30 yrs. to build. I've personally seen the evolution of the program, as I'm a product of the Valle Field-Rendel Era. 

I initially posted in support of "non-parochialism" and an open mindedness to the hiring process, which attracted a NATIONAL file of applicants. I still feel that this "out of box" perspective by RP has strengthened ISU's coast to coast image. But after reading the various SUPPORTIVE posts for Hannahs, I realized that the 3 1/2 decades had chiseled away at my emphatic understanding of TRADITION building, and how Mitch fit perfectly into the puzzle. So unlike most of you, I began as an OPPONET of the Hannahs' hiring, and converted. Thus, my steadfast positioning. Besides holding ample qualification, Hannahs also symbolized a blood relationship to the man responsible for building this TRADITION. This is a little deeper than just "popularity.":krazy:


----------



## Beav89

I will never take away from those who are disappointed when the prodigal son is passed over twice for the job.  I'm just saying that after watching posters start to take on debates with each other day after day about the topic, that perhaps the horse has been kicked enough and it's time to drag it to the glue factory.


----------



## BankShot

I always like CHEWING on those erasers, Beav...good protein!:talktohand:

Rather than comparison with the Prodigal Son, I'd rather cite the parable of the Lost Sheep.


----------



## Sycamores23

:sycamores:

Let's give Heller the support he deserves - give him a few years to show his worth and if he doesn't meet your expectations, start talking trash then! We all need to support all of our athletic teams no matter what!

Now, how do we go about keeping all those kids here that signed NLI's?!


----------

