# [January 18, 2014] Indiana State (14-3) vs #5 Wichita State (18-0)



## Jason Svoboda

*vs *





​*Indiana State Sycamores (14-3, 5-0 MVC) vs. #5 Wichita State Shockers (18-0, 5-0 MVC)
​
Charles Koch Arena - Wichita, Kansas
Saturday, January 18
​4:00 PM EST Tip​*


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## Jason Svoboda

BTW, if you're thinking of going to the game... it's been a sellout since Monday. I keep seeing Shocker fans begging on Twitter for someone to sell their tickets. That place is going to be LIVE on Saturday. We need several good practices headed into Saturday. We're also going to need a full 40 minute effort to knock them off.


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## TreeTop

Awww yeeeeah.


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## BlueSycamore

They don't play these games on paper or in the press.  Only the strong will survive this one.  I like our chances!


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## Daveinth

Finally it is time to talk about the Suckers . They have a great team has won some games . But last I knew it takes two teams to make a game and last I saw we had a pretty damn good team . Remember nothing is impossible and if the Loosiers and knock off a team with a wider talent gap than we have in this game we can as well. I never will bet against the teams I follow and so I usually sound like a Homer but I honestly feel we can go into Wichita and win . We beat them there last year lets make this an annual occurrence.


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## Callmedoc

Wichita is a great team, but have they faced anyone as good as us?? Our tempo has to be perfect our rebounding needs to be On spot.


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## cubbypike13

Callmedoc said:


> Wichita is a great team, but have they faced anyone as good as us?? Our tempo has to be perfect our rebounding needs to be On spot.



BYU, Saint Louis, Tennessee...

They have played a few good ones.


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## Callmedoc

cubbypike13 said:


> BYU, Saint Louis, Tennessee...
> 
> They have played a few good ones.



When we are on our game, we are better than all 3 of those teams. We need to expose one of their greatest weaknesses and jake odums greatest strength. The Pick and roll and pick and pop have been a buggaboo to them for a while.


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## rpatterson4

With the combination of our game verses Whichita St., and the Brady Vs Manning matchup I really would like to bust this guy out this weekend!

http://www.bustedtees.com/perfectseason181


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## Westbadenboy

If you were in Salt Lake City in 1979 you heard the Michigan State fans chanting "33 & 1" --- both in the streets prior to the game and during the game.
(Unfortunately that turned out to be true)
If .................If .................If we would get beat this Saturday at WSU I hope The Forest (and adult fans too) will take up that idea at the Feb. 5 game with WSU at Hulman Center.

         "22 & 1"      "22 & 1"     "22 & 1"   (Or whatever their record is at the time -- assuming they are undefeated)

Hey it will still work if the chant is "21 & 2"   "21 & 2"  on Feb. 5th
       Even Better ......................


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## GuardShock

I seriously can not wait for this game. We have a true chance and our guys are playing great basketball right now. We knock them off and the WHOLE country will be talking about little ole Indiana State University!


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## Jason Svoboda

I know games aren't played on paper, but statistically we appear to be in for a big let down Saturday. Just updated my Valley Stats spreadsheet and it is going to take a fantastic game plan being executed near perfectly as well as a big defensive effort to win. The other thing that worries me is how definitively the Shockers outrebound their opponents.


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## GuardShock

Well let's hope I don't eat my words but we've been good at taking care of the ball for the most part. This is perfect timing for this game. Hope they watched tape on what the Bears did. I won't be mad with a loss, but we've been good there in the past. If anyone can do it, its us. Period. We're improved on the road this year and our guys are really hitting on all cylinders. It doesn't sound like anyone is beat up.


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## BudDawgII

Anyone know what the early line is on this game?  What do u guys think the point spread will be on Saturday?


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## ISUCC

BudDawgII said:


> Anyone know what the early line is on this game?  What do u guys think the point spread will be on Saturday?



I'd guess 9-11 points will be the spread. I'll be interested to see how we handle their full court press, Bradley did not handle it well the other night. So hopefully our guards are ready.


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## Westbadenboy

Wonder if they are cranking up the noise at Hulman Center during practice to help prepare for the WSU crowd ?

Gee   Hope Wichita will wish they had done that same thing at their practices when the its about midnight on Feb. 5th


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## BlueSycamore

I would guess the line at about 5.  The target on the Shocker's is getting bigger and bigger............................................


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## BrokerZ

I can't help but to allow the St. Louis game to affect my judgement.  We were absolutely crushed/embarrased/killed by St. Louis while WSU took care of business against SLU. That does't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling going into this game.  Winning on the road in conference is difficult no matter what, and winning on the road against a top-5 opponent makes it even harder.

For now, I'm cautiously optimistic and will hope to be pleasantly surprised if we show well in Wichita.


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## BlueBleeder

BrokerZ said:


> I can't help but to allow the St. Louis game to affect my judgement.  We were absolutely crushed/embarrased/killed by St. Louis while WSU took care of business against SLU. That does't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling going into this game.  Winning on the road in conference is difficult no matter what, and winning on the road against a top-5 opponent makes it even harder.
> 
> For now, I'm cautiously optimistic and will hope to be pleasantly surprised if we show well in Wichita.



I have had some of those same feelings about this game....but I keep coming around to the fact that we played very inconsistently the first 10 games of the season....we seem to have righted that ship and when our shots aren't falling our defense picks us up.  That didn't happen earlier in the year.  I am one of the most diehard fans you will meet, but I simply don't think we will win in Wichita if they play their best and we dont...it will take the best 40 minutes of basketball we have played since the Creighton game last year to have a chance.  I hope like hell we win....but honestly I will be happy with great execution and effort for 40 minutes and if we happen to win that is just icing on the cake!  I think we win the game in Terre Haute.....sure would be sweet to sweep though!!


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## IndyTreeFan

BlueBleeder said:


> I have had some of those same feelings about this game....but I keep coming around to the fact that we played very inconsistently the first 10 games of the season....we seem to have righted that ship and when our shots aren't falling our defense picks us up.  That didn't happen earlier in the year.  I am one of the most diehard fans you will meet, but I simply don't think we will win in Wichita if they play their best and we dont...it will take the best 40 minutes of basketball we have played since the Creighton game last year to have a chance.  I hope like hell we win....but honestly I will be happy with great execution and effort for 40 minutes and if we happen to win that is just icing on the cake!  I think we win the game in Terre Haute.....sure would be sweet to sweep though!!



Ditto.  It will require extraordinary focus and effort to win there.  I hope we play really well and keep it close.  If you get to the under 4:00 TO in the second half and it's close, anything can happen!!!


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## treeman

honestly i feel more confident going into this game than i will playing @northern iowa or @illinois state. The guys will come out loose with nothing to lose, i expect a close game and hopefully the ball will fall our way down the stretch.

Trees 68
Shock 63


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## kvicroy

4 tickets left at https://www.stubhub.com/wichita-sta...ita-state-vs-indiana-state-1-18-2014-4368061/


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## pbutler218

ISU will have to get more contribution from it's bigs in this game. Anyone have word on when big Mike Samuels will be able to join the fray???


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## GuardShock

ISU 72 Wichita 70. Dang I hope.


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## ISUCC

WSU fans trying to come up with sign ideas for the game Saturday, so far not a real creative bunch over there. 

http://shockernet.net/forum/showthr...ndiana-State-at-the-Roundhouse-01-18-14/page2


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## Jason Svoboda

pbutler218 said:


> ISU will have to get more contribution from it's bigs in this game. Anyone have word on when big Mike Samuels will be able to join the fray???



They will all certainly need to bring their lunch pails. We've struggled against the two most physical teams on our schedule to this point (St. Louis and Tulsa) and our bigs will need to crash the boards and keep their guys off the glass. If Kitch/Gant/Moore are spending a lot of time setting high screens like we normally do on offense, I don't think it is going to end well for us. 

Also is imperative that Arop is ready to play on both ends of the floor. Jamar Gulley had his way with him and I'm sure Marshall will be all over Cotton to do the same, especially since he is shooting at a high rate this year.


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## Jason Svoboda

IndyTreeFan said:


> Ditto.  It will require extraordinary focus and effort to win there.  I hope we play really well and keep it close.  If you get to the under 4:00 TO in the second half and it's close, anything can happen!!!



Yep, just have to grind and keep it close. I hope we shorten our rotation for this one, too.


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## Southgrad07

3 keys

- keep them off the offensive glass
- minimize TO's while still attacking their pressure
-  Get the majority of the 50/50 balls. 

 Love that we are their big home game this season. When was the last time ISU was THE game for someone?? I have a good feeling about us coming out and playing well in this game. I think WSU will come out ready too, so we'll see how it all plays out! Cant freakin wait for Saturday!


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## SycamoreStateofMind

Shox 76
Trees 74


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## Bluethunder

After watching St. Louis get physical with us and how poorly we responded to it, and having watched how physical the shockers play, and having this game in Wichita where are not likely to get the benefit of too many whistles, I have a hard time being confident about this game. 

Have we been playing better since the St. Louis game, yes.  Did we learn a few things in that game, I hope so.  Is Wichita State a better team than St. Louis, absolutely.  We will have to play a nearly flawless game against the shockers to come out with a win.

Nothing would make me happier than to see a victory for the boys in blue, but when I put aside my bias for all things blue and just look at this game based on what I have seen of both teams this year, I cannot say with any truthfulness that I expect a victory.  Hope yes, expect no.  As much as it pains me to say it, wichita st. is just that good this year.  They are at a level above the rest of us in the MVC.

Will still be watching and hoping to be proven wrong, nothing would make me happier.


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## BallyPie

Didn't we beat that team last year in Wichita??.....YES.......has all of Odum's teams over the years played well in Wichita??....YES..............for those two reasons, I give us a decent chance of pulling this off......no pressure on us.....it's all on the Shox.........we should be able to play loose and have fun with it.....


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## ISU_TREE_FAN

36 teams have not lost since Christmas...Indiana State and Wichita State are both in that club.— Mark Adams (@EnthusiAdams) January 14, 2014



He is one of the announcers for the game Saturday.  Has lots of tweets out there complimenting both teams.


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## SycamorePsycho

BallyPie said:


> Didn't we beat that team last year in Wichita??.....YES.......has all of Odum's teams over the years played well in Wichita??....YES..............for those two reasons, I give us a decent chance of pulling this off......no pressure on us.....it's all on the Shox.........we should be able to play loose and have fun with it.....



Pretty sure Odum is 2-6 in Wichita...


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## Southgrad07

SycamorePsycho said:


> Pretty sure Odum is 2-6 in Wichita...



So this is his 9th trip there?Holy shit he must be older than Grant Gibbs then!! Lol He's 1-2 in Wichita but in both defeats we played  well and had chances to win. He's 2-6 overall so i get your point. We have seemed to play them better there though for whatever reason.


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## SycamorePsycho

Southgrad07 said:


> So this is his 9th trip there?Holy shit he must be older than Grant Gibbs then!! Lol He's 1-2 in Wichita but in both defeats we played  well and had chances to win. He's 2-6 overall so i get your point. We have seemed to play them better there though for whatever reason.



LOL...correction...Odum is 2-6 AGAINST Wichita :biggrin:


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## BallyPie

Southgrad07 said:


> So this is his 9th trip there?Holy shit he must be older than Grant Gibbs then!! Lol He's 1-2 in Wichita but in both defeats we played  well and had chances to win. He's 2-6 overall so i get your point. We have seemed to play them better there though for whatever reason.




I've heard Matt Renn before say he loved playing at Wichita......even Odum and Cummings mentioned on Wed how electric the crowd is there.  I guess for a player, this is the kind of atmosphere you relish playing in......maybe this is why we've been playing well there.


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## IndyTreeFan

Khristian Smith is the key to this game for us.  If he has a big game, Wichita could be in trouble.  Didn't say "will be in trouble," said could be.  Heck, we could play really well and still get beat.  But I think Khristian is the key for us.


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## Jason Svoboda

Here are the box scores to both games last year:

http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330292724 - Sycamores 68, #15 Shockers 55
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330500282 - Shockers 66, Sycamores 62


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## GuardShock

Jason Svoboda said:


> Here are the box scores to both games last year:
> 
> http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330292724 - Sycamores 68, #15 Shockers 55
> http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330500282 - Shockers 66, Sycamores 62



Here's what I notice, keep the turnovers down and out rebound them and we win this game. We can out score em. Just gotta stay smart and no stupid turnovers.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

As we've learned in the past, this game tomorrow will not make or break the season for the Trees. But, a win here would go a long way toward making sure the Trees are in the at-large conversation for the rest of the college hoops season. I don't really think you can overstate how big of a game this really is. 

The Shox will be looking to put us away early, if they let us hang around and find open shooters in the second half, watch out!!!

I am awfully excited for this one - should be a heck of a battle! 

What to watch for:

- Can Odum get it going. Odum is yet to have that one game where you walk away knowing he was the best player on the floor. My guess is he draws one of the Valley's best defenders in Cotton and that leaves VanVleet for Cummings - we could win both of those match-ups. 

- Shutting down Early, Cotton, Baker and VanVleet. Sure the Shox have other options but these are the guys who can best us. Got to figure that Brown plays increased mins in trying to shut down and rattle VanVleet. Smith and Arop also athletic and capable defenders when they want to be. Arop can't let Early get loose like he did Gulley from Mo State.

- 3 point shooting, Cummings has been shooting it as well as any shooter in maybe the entire country the last 5 games a combined 9-21 from long range. If he can continue that hot shooting it is sure to open up some things inside. The Sycamores will need KSmith to get back on track from long range, 0 for his last 7. 

- Rebounding will be a factor, the Sycamores can't allow the shox to get second chance points in front of the home crowd, best way to take them out of the game will be to rebound the baskeball. That means Moore, Gant, Manny and Smith in that order will need to block out and attack rebounds! Gant has only had 10 rebounds his last 3 games, that is a sub 4 avg. for your center and biggest body at most times.

- Lastly coaching, Marshall is one of the best in all the country and will have his team well prepared - keep in mind they've got a days worth of fresher legs having played on Tuesday. But Lansing has taken this bunch on the road the past few years and upset the apple cart a few times, gotta think he's got his guys all fired up for this one!

To be the best you gotta beat the best, rarely do you get that chance as a mid major - our first comes tomorrow night!

Let's enjoy this one Sycamore Nation!! They simply don't get any bigger than this!!


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## Westbadenboy

Right On ! ! !


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## Keep Calm & March On

"Bandaged-Head Sycamore" says, "just go to Wichita and WIN"!!! GO TREES!!!


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## TreeTop

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebask...work-life-in-the-valley?ex_cid=espnapi_public

Andy Katz view on the game.


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## TreeTop




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## meistro

Quabachi said:


> http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebask...work-life-in-the-valley?ex_cid=espnapi_public
> 
> Andy Katz view on the game.



Did you notice he said all of our losses were respectable, interesting.


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## Jason Svoboda

Line opened with Shox as 11.5 point favorites.


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## ISUCC

great article from Golden about what could be gained with an ISU win today, good read

http://www.tribstar.com/sports/x176...ittle-to-lose-a-lot-to-gain-for-Indiana-State


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## ISUCC

and from the Wichita paper today

http://www.kansas.com/2014/01/17/3235125/hot-shooting-indiana-state-knows.html


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## Southgrad07

Mark Adams tweeted Lansing said Khristian Smith has a 102 temperature. Not a great little news nugget to see on gameday... Hopefully our shooting is as hot as Khristian's forehead!


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## pbutler218

Not good news at all. He's one of our better scoring options. Always something it seems.


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## BudDawgII

ISUCC said:


> great article from Golden about what could be gained with an ISU win today, good read
> 
> http://www.tribstar.com/sports/x176...ittle-to-lose-a-lot-to-gain-for-Indiana-State



----very nice article!


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## SycamoreStateofMind

Digger Phelps with some love on GameDay baby!!

Wichita State home today vs Indiana State, "they better be careful, Indiana State is very good and very physical". 

And Jay Billias 

I agree with that Digger - 

"Manny Arop the transfer from Gonzaga is a good player along with Jake Odum a good shooter and guard". 

You don't even have to be able to shoot the ball to get love from the National Media. Just fake it!!


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## Jason Svoboda

Game Day


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## BudDawgII

Jason Svoboda said:


> Game Day


Is everyone all jacked up for this afternoon?  Double header down here--going to Ford Center to watch Aces and Loyola at 1PM---then run to a tv somewhere to watch The Trees!  ISU Alumni group going to be at Old Chicago on the East side ---nice place to eat and party and watch the Trees battle the Shockers!


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## IndyTreeFan

Southgrad07 said:


> Mark Adams tweeted Lansing said Khristian Smith has a 102 temperature. Not a great little news nugget to see on gameday... Hopefully our shooting is as hot as Khristian's forehead!



He tweeted later that Khristian is fine.  I think he was kidding.  I hope...


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## treeman

great opportunity presented to us today. i have a lot of confidence in our guys to go in there and have a competitive and entertaining game for the nation to see! :sign-logo::sign-gostatewin:


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## TreeTop

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/TribStarTodd">@TribStarTodd</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/14Ridge_TTKA5">@14Ridge_TTKA5</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/ErikScearce">@ErikScearce</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/JustTheBatman">@JustTheBatman</a> and I are beyond excited to be here representing <a href="https://twitter.com/ISUForest">@ISUForest</a>. <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23GoSycamores&src=hash">#GoSycamores</a>!!!</p>— Tommy Lynch (@SycamoreLynch) <a href="https://twitter.com/SycamoreLynch/statuses/424437344612016128">January 18, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

That's crazy.  Way to represent!


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## ISUCC

IndyTreeFan said:


> He tweeted later that Khristian is fine.  I think he was kidding.  I hope...



good to know ITF, that would have been a bummer if he had to miss this game


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## Jason Svoboda

Will we see any zone today?

If there was ever a game for us to use it for awhile, it's this one.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

Jason Svoboda said:


> Will we see any zone today?
> 
> If there was ever a game for us to use it for awhile, it's this one.



Only reason we won't see much of it is second chance opps, Lansing is going to try and limit those. Tougher to rebound out of the zone.

Watch early on, he's going to get creative with his matchups in strait up
man-ta-man.


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## Sycamore Proud

ISUCC said:


> good to know ITF, that would have been a bummer if he had to miss this game



Now does all this mean KSmith is sick. or fine or sick but going to play anyway?  I have seen some kids play the game of their life when playing sick and totally concentrating on the game.  Certainly you can't count on sick kids playing at all. But it's not unheard of.


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## TreeTop

Best hyped game of the day:  ISU vs WSU

Worst game of the day (in general):  Lemoyne-Owen vs #17 Memphis.....gawd, that's the worst scheduling I've heard of, maybe ever...a D2 team in the middle of the conference play.


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## TreeTop




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## BrokerZ

This will be very simple.  If we get out rebounded, we lose. If we win the battle on the boards, we have a chance. No need to write a dissertation on the keys to the game. There's only one stat that will matter today: rebounding.


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## TreeTop

BrokerZ said:


> There's only one stat that will matter today: rebounding.



Not turnovers?


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## treeman

BrokerZ said:


> There's only one stat that will matter today: rebounding.



not scoring more points than them?

I kid I kid, but seriously.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

Quabachi said:


> Not turnovers?



Turnovers is certainly something that can nagate winning the battle of the boards. We could out rebound them and turn it over 8 more times than them and lose.

That's why it's not the ONLY thing we gotta do. Gotta rip the 3 point nets, that will be very important for us!


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## TreeTop

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Some of <a href="https://twitter.com/ISUForest">@ISUForest</a> made it to Wichita. In background is WSU student section. <a href="http://t.co/YS06KRL1NT">pic.twitter.com/YS06KRL1NT</a></p>— Todd Golden (@TribStarTodd) <a href="https://twitter.com/TribStarTodd/statuses/424637483704254464">January 18, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


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## TreeTop

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>MVC commissioner Doug Elgin is here. So is MVC Director of Officials Eddie Jackson. I see fouls in our future.</p>— Todd Golden (@TribStarTodd) <a href="https://twitter.com/TribStarTodd/statuses/424639640952262656">January 18, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


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## SycamoreStateofMind

If your not fired up yet. Let this help you set the enviorment 

http://www.hark.com/clips/bdvxgprxbl-zombie-nation-ohohohoh


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## Southgrad07

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> Turnovers is certainly something that can nagate winning the battle of the boards. We could out rebound them and turn it over 8 more times than them and lose.
> 
> That's why it's not the ONLY thing we gotta do. Gotta rip the 3 point nets, that will be very important for us!



Shooting the 3 ball well can make up for errors in other areas. Taking care of the ball is critical regardless of how we're shooting. I'll be interested to see how much success Gant and Moore have down low against WSU's bigs.


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## Bluethunder

Sycamore Proud said:


> Now does all this mean KSmith is sick. or fine or sick but going to play anyway?  I have seen some kids play the game of their life when playing sick and totally concentrating on the game.  Certainly you can't count on sick kids playing at all. But it's not unheard of.



They way Adams tweeted it, I took it to mean that KSmith was very, very hyped up for this game to the point of being almost delirious, and Lansing made the joke (paraphrasing) "either that or he has a 102 temp."  Adams tweeted shortly after that message that KSmith was fine and had no temperature.  I think it was an inside joke that didn't come across well over twitter.


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## Bluethunder

Quabachi said:


> <blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Some of <a href="https://twitter.com/ISUForest">@ISUForest</a> made it to Wichita. In background is WSU student section. <a href="http://t.co/YS06KRL1NT">pic.twitter.com/YS06KRL1NT</a></p>— Todd Golden (@TribStarTodd) <a href="https://twitter.com/TribStarTodd/statuses/424637483704254464">January 18, 2014</a></blockquote>
> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>



TOMMY LYNCH IS THE MAN!!!!!!


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## bent20

Hopefully the enormous crowd gets our guys pumped. Especially quieting them.


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## bent20

We're on the board first with a Cummings' three.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

Cummings the only one who has gone to the rim. Everyone else settling for jump shots.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

go to the hooooooop!


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## bent20

Radio guys questioning some of the calls from the refs already. Our guys aren't real bad homers either.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

One bad push off shoulda been called on VanVleet bucket other than that not my beef.

Earn a call and go to the rim.


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## BrokerZ

Well...we really can't shoot it much worse at this point. Only can go up from here.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

Jump shot

Jump shot 

Jump shot 

Go to the hoop!


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## Westbadenboy

For the hype about the noise at WSU it never comes across on TV  sounds pretty quiet to me on on ESPN2


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## BudDawgII

Trees are battling on defense!
Shoot the damn ball Odom!


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## Gotta Hav

The announcer just said that we are dogging the ball up the floor..and that we need to push it....is that the same thing as dillying and dallying?


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## Southgrad07

Will the real jake odum please stand up!!


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## TreeTop

Gotta Hav said:


> The announcer just said that we are dogging the ball up the floor..and that we need to push it....is that the same thing as dillying and dallying?



Also similar to lollygagging.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

Paging Jake Odum, Jake Odum the game has started. It is in Wichita, Kansas (city not a state) we are playing Wichita State.

You gotta come alive son!


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## BrokerZ

They are a completely different team without Fred.


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## bent20

Quabachi said:


> Also similar to lollygagging.



Do we want to push it every time up the floor. We're both running teams, but I have to think it favors them more.


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## SycamoreStateofMind

BrokerZ said:


> They are a completely different team without Fred.



As are we when we are passive. Best offensive team in the Valley with 16 pts under 4 to play in half thats terrible.


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## Westbadenboy

Gant seemed great early in the season, but just like last year he's lost all his offensive mojo -- always seems indecisive when he gets the all.


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## BudDawgII

Who would have thought our defense would be out shining our offense?


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## bent20

We're just playing sloppy, as we tend to do at times.


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## GuardShock

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> As are we when we are passive. Best offensive team in the Valley with 16 pts under 4 to play in half thats terrible.



against the best defense we've played all year. And we've kept them  to 7 field goals and 22 points. I'm impressed by our defense.


----------



## BrokerZ

We clearly focused on defense in practice this week, and we're playing as pretty well so far.  At this point, we need to find some offense.  We need Brown to attack the rim a few times to soften up the WSU defense.


----------



## BlueBleeder

I don't know what we are doing .....and it looks like the team doesn't either.  We should be pushing the tempo on misses and turnovers, yet we are slowly bringing the ball up the court and of coarse missing nearly every single open shot we've had.  Wichita is one of the best half court defensive teams there is....and we are playing right into their hands letting them set up everytime.  It is this kind of thing that our coaching staff seems to miss or not fix


----------



## Westbadenboy

ditto on my Gant comment !


----------



## Westbadenboy

Double ditto on Gant


----------



## BudDawgII

Where the hell is our offense!


----------



## BrokerZ

It's like they we're told all week that they need to control their emotions and settle down, but what we're doing is playing passive.  We need to control emotions, but come on...be assertive!


----------



## Jason Svoboda

0 free throws.


----------



## True Blue

Gant and Arop are pissing down their legs.  VanVleet pushes off on every drive.  Those are my observations.


----------



## Chief_Quabachi

Our "bigs" can't throw the ball in the ocean.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

True Blue said:


> Gant and Arop are pissing down their legs.  VanVleet pushes off on every drive.  Those are my observations.



No argument here.


----------



## hans1950

We are playing scared on offense.Jake hasn't put any pressure on the defense all day.Gant has lost whatever he had going at the beginning of the year.Odum is too unselfish.Be a leader out there Jake.


----------



## BrokerZ

I'm encouraged by the defense, obviously.  We just need to break them down on offense and take the ball to the cup. I'm tired of the announcers saying that we need to control our emotions...we need to get emotional! Get aggressive and play pissed.

And...VanVleet should have at least 2 offensive fouls at this point.


----------



## ISUCC

gonna come down to how we start the 2nd half, gonna need to start strong offensively


----------



## Southgrad07

Gant, arop, odum, and smith.. what the hell guys??... thank god for Cummings or this thing would be 15+! Only guy who is attacking them instead of being attacked


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Playing this game like they are afraid (like some of you) to get blown out! 

You can say WSU has played good D all you want, we still gotta force action. So are you telling me Dawon Cummings is the only freaking player that can go to the rim? Because he's gone 3 times and scored twice and had the 3rd rim out.


----------



## bigsportsfan

Random thoughts....."

They are in our grills when we shoot. We need to shot fake more or "clear space" like they do.

The ESPN announcers are horrible. I switched to Fritz and Renn.

We are moving slowly in getting the ball up the court.

I'd love to know what's up with Gant. Not that he's our only problem, buy I expected him to be a12-8 rock every night and it hasn't happened. Still can't believe we didn't RS him as a freshman.

Based on this half, Wichita doesn't look the caliber of Arizona. Syracuse, etc. but we don't look whatever caliber we're supposed to be either.


----------



## TreeTop

Down by 9, could be worse if not for Jake's history making free throws.

Hopefully we'll make some adjustments and take this game down to the wire...for the win.


----------



## GuardShock

Looked at our past games and it seems as though we normally shoot better second half.. Let's see if that will hold true. Overall I don't think we're too bad, but I'm over these announcers. We can come back.

We will come back.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

GuardShock said:


> Looked at our past games and it seems as though we normally shoot better second half.. Let's see if that will hold true. Overall I don't think we're too bad, but I'm over these announcers. We can come back.
> 
> We will come back.



Yeah well we just scored 22 points in a half... Ya can't do a whole hell of a lot worse than that. 

As it playing an undefeated ranked team on the road comes around every year.


----------



## BallyPie

we just need to settle down......at least IU lost to NW....that makes me feel better


----------



## BudDawgII

Our weak schedule gets exposed when we play teams like St Louis and WS!


----------



## Westbadenboy

Triple ditto on Gant


----------



## BallyPie

bad day for the lid to be on the basket....


----------



## GuardShock

GANT IS HORRIBLE WITH THE BALL. Take him out if he is going to suck. It happens every game.


----------



## True Blue

Het Gant out of the fucking game!  He sucks


----------



## Westbadenboy

Quarruple ditto on Gant

He is killing us !


----------



## BrokerZ

The blowout is on. Terrible...just terrible.


----------



## BudDawgII

VanVleet is a man among boyzs!


----------



## GuardShock

Why don't we drive the ball?


----------



## bluestreak

Gant is getting eaten alive.


----------



## ISUCC

pretty much over, we won't even cover the spread today. Like someone said, our weak schedule has been exposed by WSU and St. Louis.


----------



## bigsportsfan

Great halftime speech.


----------



## BudDawgII

we act like we are scared to death


----------



## Westbadenboy

We've played dazed and confused the entire game


----------



## Southgrad07

You all wonder why our guards don't pass it down low... Gant  and kitchell have at least 5 to's on post ups or post feeds...so soft


----------



## Chief_Quabachi

Pussies!!!


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

ISUCC said:


> pretty much over, we won't even cover the spread today. Like someone said, our weak schedule has been exposed by WSU and St. Louis.



Oh the ISUCC "its over" post, now you know this is real life...


----------



## Westbadenboy

and no -- despite wjhat the announcers say -- its not due to WSU


----------



## BudDawgII

bigsportsfan said:


> Great halftime speech.


Great halftime adjustments ---Lansing!


----------



## GuardShock

I've muted these Suck Ass 'Play Angry" announcers. Here's another question, why does Gant guard the 3 point line? That makes a mis match with K smith guarding the post?


----------



## BudDawgII

-----Boys this team is not Truman State!


----------



## TH_Sycamore12

BudDawgII said:


> Great halftime adjustments ---Lansing!






Players coach





Sent from my SGH-i917 using Tapatalk


----------



## BudDawgII

-----playing like a junior varsity high school team!


----------



## bigsportsfan

11-0 to start the half


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

See ISU Creighton game last year on national TV. Different year, different team(s) similar result


----------



## ISU_TREE_FAN

PISS POOR SHOWING BY THE BOYS IN BLUE............GETTING TO BE EMBARASSING


----------



## BallyPie

Westbadenboy said:


> and no -- despite wjhat the announcers say -- its not due to WSU



agree.....we're getting good looks.....nothing falling.....just one of those days....


----------



## TH_Sycamore12

"Why can't we get 10K? Why can't we get 10K?" 

Sent from my SGH-i917 using Tapatalk


----------



## BudDawgII

BudDawgII said:


> -----Boys this team is not Truman State!



I thought we were one of the top scoring teams in the nation!


----------



## BrokerZ

I'm running out of things to say.


----------



## GuardShock

Bring in Bell, Bring in Bell. Bring in Bell!!!


----------



## Westbadenboy

Who is teaching Gant to pause everytime he gets the ball low ...........EVERYTIME !  Never turns out good .........NEVER !


----------



## BrokerZ

GuardShock said:


> Bring in Bell, Bring in Bell. Bring in Bell!!!



Ask and you shall receive.


----------



## ISUCC

well, it only took us 8 min. to get our 1st FG this half


----------



## BudDawgII

BrokerZ said:


> I'm running out of things to say.



------so is Lansing!


----------



## GuardShock

BrokerZ said:


> Ask and you shall receive.



Well, every time Gant leaves the post on defense they drive against either K smith or Kitchell and neither of them can block anything in the paint today.


----------



## BrokerZ

ISUCC said:


> well, it only took us 8 min. to get our 1st FG this half



You don't want to rush these things. Have to play patient and control our emotions, you know.


----------



## cubbypike13

Boys we are just getting punched in the mouth and our team isn't responding. 

While I don't take moral victories, maybe this is the realization that the Sycamores need to show where we as a team need to be by the end of the season.

Marshall drew up a solid game plan to take care of Jake and nobody else is responding.


----------



## GuardShock

I see a solution, give Devonte the ball every time. Let him drive and get all of them fouled out of the game.


----------



## BrokerZ

cubbypike13 said:


> Boys we are just getting punched in the mouth and our team isn't responding.
> 
> While I don't take moral victories, maybe this is the realization that the Sycamores need to show where we as a team need to be by the end of the season.
> 
> Marshall drew up a solid game plan to take care of Jake and nobody else is responding.



That's what everyone said after the St. Louis game, too.


----------



## ISUCC

kinda feel bad for Sycamore Lynch and the other students who drove 10 hours to witness THIS


----------



## Bluethunder

As someone who always tries to see the positive in any situation, we had hoped to get some national recognition with this game, and the good news is we will.  Now, instead of people saying "Indiana State?", they will say "Indiana State? Oh yea, your the guys who got the piss beat out of you by Wichita State and couldn't even score 40 points on national television!  Yea, I know you!"

Everyone will know us now, of course it will mostly be to laugh at us, but they will know us nonetheless.


----------



## GuardShock

I ought to just start doing homework. This game is over boys.


----------



## TH_Sycamore12

The decision now comes down to: CBI or CIT?

Sent from my SGH-i917 using Tapatalk


----------



## Bluethunder

GuardShock said:


> I ought to just start doing homework. This game is over boys.



Ive been watching the Syracuse/Pitt game for the last twenty minutes.  Really good game.


----------



## TreeTop

This is depressing.


----------



## BrokerZ

Kitchel has as many points for Wichita State as he does ISU.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Odum sleeping on D gets back cut. Terrible.


----------



## hans1950

We haven't responded to Wichita's intensity at all.When teams get in our face we don't usually play well on offense.That is magnified today for sure.We are a pretty good team but obviously no match for the athletes Wichita has.20 plus wins this year but we're going nowhere else.


----------



## cubbypike13

BrokerZ said:


> That's what everyone said after the St. Louis game, too.



We responded with a seven game winning streak after that. So I hope we have the same response.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Cummings the only kid that came to play. Turning into our best player and not sure that is a good thing.


----------



## BrokerZ

Cummings has accounted for 45% of our offense so far.


----------



## BudDawgII

This is what an ass kicking looks like!
We look like a very soft team----no fight in us!


----------



## Sycamores13

They've played scared the whole game. Jake needed to step up 10 minutes ago.


----------



## Westbadenboy

Just bought our tickets for the Feb. 5 home vs WSU ............

Will be interesting to see how e respond ..............

Is this the beginning of what we've seen the past two years -- good season starts then crap ?


----------



## BrokerZ

WSU will have three first-team all MVC players with VanVleet, Baker, and Early. They are clearly very, very good.


----------



## Bluethunder

The only thing that matters now is making sure this game only ends up as one loss.  We get it over with, go to Loyola on Wednesday and get a win.  If we sit around feeling sorry for ourselves and cause this hangover to let us play this bad at Loyola, then we let it beat us twice.

Lose by 2, or lose by 102, it is still a loss.  Just can't let it get in our head and cause us to lose again, and again, and again.

We are still 5-1 in the conference and 14-4 overall, and everyone but Wichita State would gladly trade places with us.

You play 30 some games in a season, you have days like this.  WSU is better than us, period.  Are they this much better than us, no, but again, it only counts as one loss.

Learn a little from it, put it out of your head and start winning again.  This loss is not a big deal (we all had this down as a loss), but losing Wednesday would be a killer. 

Lets see how we respond.


----------



## GuardShock

I think we should let our bench play minus cummings and let them play. They need the experience. Cummings seemed to have showed up today.


----------



## SamWild

This is a blueprint for how to beat ISU. When Vanfleet and Baker (guards) outmuscle Kitchel, Gant, and anyone else we put down low you have a problem. To beat us, guard the 3 and breath on anyone down low to take them out of the play. 

Who is the strength coach!?!


----------



## GeoffreyK

Pretty disappointing game thus far, don't see it changing much in the last 6 minutes.  I was really expecting at least a bit more of a fight today, given both teams' records, but I suppose, as others have said, we just can't match up against such a highly ranked team. Really puts us in perspective after all the nice press the team got this week.  Here's hoping the rest of the season isn't like this Wichita game.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Cummings got 19 of 43!! Hahaha


----------



## BallyPie

I maybe crazy....but I think WS is beat-able if we play like we did against Creighton last year at home......


----------



## SamWild

Not beatable by us when Wessel (another guard) can outmuscle for an offensive board like he just did


----------



## Sycamores13

BallyPie said:


> I maybe crazy....but I think WS is beat-able if we play like we did against Creighton last year at home......



Anyone is beatable if we play like we did in that game.


----------



## TreeTop

BallyPie said:


> I maybe crazy....but I think WS is beat-able if we play like we did against Creighton last year at home......



Not crazy.  Hell, they're beatable today if we had scored a field goal prior to the 12 minute mark in the second half.


----------



## GuardShock

This is what realtimerpi says that we will lose by. If we made it to 59 I'd be happy!

  01-18	  at	 Wichita St. 	 17-0 (5-0)	9	 59-78 L - Scouting


----------



## bent20

WSU is a great team, but biggest difference today is confidence. They look like world beaters, we look like a team ready for an ass beating and that's what we're getting, on national tv no less.


----------



## Chief_Quabachi

I didn't see any Sycamore play with an attitude today....maybe cummings but hard to tell because he seldom show any emotion.


----------



## Westbadenboy

Odum did not need to step up 10 minutes ago -- he needed to walk out of the dressing room at the start of the game "stepped up"

The kid looks very good some games but man he just disappears sometimes in big games -- see Iowa game last year   NIT


----------



## Westbadenboy

Ever notice when ISU -- in FB or BB -- seems to start getting some attention, has a chance to break through we stumble -- not just a little, but we just stink up the place


----------



## BudDawgII

Bluethunder said:


> The only thing that matters now is making sure this game only ends up as one loss.  We get it over with, go to Loyola on Wednesday and get a win.  If we sit around feeling sorry for ourselves and cause this hangover to let us play this bad at Loyola, then we let it beat us twice.
> 
> Lose by 2, or lose by 102, it is still a loss.  Just can't let it get in our head and cause us to lose again, and again, and again.
> 
> We are still 5-1 in the conference and 14-4 overall, and everyone but Wichita State would gladly trade places with us.
> 
> You play 30 some games in a season, you have days like this.  WSU is better than us, period.  Are they this much better than us, no, but again, it only counts as one loss.
> 
> Learn a little from it, put it out of your head and start winning again.  This loss is not a big deal (we all had this down as a loss), but losing Wednesday would be a killer.
> 
> Lets see how we respond.



What matters is-----that this mature talented team is soft as hell inside!  Hell--Bradley took us to the wire last week and we have played soft most of the season!  We need to grow some balls and get some fight in our tank soon or its not going to be fun in Feb and March!


----------



## bent20

Westbadenboy said:


> Ever notice when ISU -- in FB or BB -- seems to start getting some attention, has a chance to break through we stumble -- not just a little, but we just stink up the place



No confidence. No edge.


----------



## TreeTop

Westbadenboy said:


> Ever notice when ISU -- in FB or BB -- seems to start getting some attention, has a chance to break through we stumble -- not just a little, but we just stink up the place



Oh yeah.  Definitely noticed.


----------



## SamWild

pbutler218 said:


> If ISU doesn't start recruiting big men who can finish inside then they might as well settle for more of the same......EVERY year.



More from day one!

Sorry, didn't mean it, but couldn't help myself.


----------



## bent20

We did recruit a guy who should be finishing inside. If Gant can't do it then what the hell are we to expect? The guy was recruited by half the freaking Big 10. We have some good players, but they don't always play like it. I see a team that doesn't just struggle with technique, they struggle with attitude, with confidence. To compete against the best you have to execute and be on it. I saw so much sloppy play today, guys being stripped under the basket like they were Red Riding Hood being mugged by the Big Bad Wolf, play with some attitude and an edge. Play like the underdog on the road, not the team their for its beating.


----------



## BudDawgII

What were the positives today?


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

BudDawgII said:


> What were the positives today?



Cummings.






The end.


----------



## BallyPie

I wonder who is having the bigger meltdown.....this message board or IU's message board....


----------



## bluebill

What we seen today was about the best defence and rebounding 
play we have or will see this year.  Even when they come to 
Terre Haute.  Wish it had not been against us but from a performance 
standpoint it was outstanding.  Their balance was out of site on both
ends of the floor.
We played fairly good D but no shots falling ( due to the D against us)
Our D was one half step behind and cost us in fouls.  LOTS of fouls.







bent20 said:


> WSU is a great team, but biggest difference today is confidence. They look like world beaters, we look like a team ready for an ass beating and that's what we're getting, on national tv no less.


----------



## GuardShock

bent20 said:


> We did recruit a guy who should be finishing inside. If Gant can't do it then what the hell are we to expect? The guy was recruited by half the freaking Big 10. We have some good players, but they don't always play like it. I see a team that doesn't just struggle with technique, they struggle with attitude, with confidence. To compete against the best you have to execute and be on it. I saw so much sloppy play today, guys being stripped under the basket like they were Red Riding Hood being mugged by the Big Bad Wolf, play with some attitude and an edge. Play like the underdog on the road, not the team their for its beating.



We need Marshall Henderson from Ole miss as an Assistant coach after he graduates this year! lol


----------



## Southgrad07

BudDawgII said:


> What were the positives today?



Cummings and that nobody got hurt... other than that it was embarrassing on every level


----------



## sycamorebacker

SamWild said:


> Who is the strength coach!?!



Duh!  Nobody on here has said we are strong inside.  And it has nothing to do with the strength coach and everything to do with the players that we have.


----------



## GuardShock

Southgrad07 said:


> Cummings and that nobody got hurt... other than that it was embarrassing on every level



Well, on a side and positive note. Cummings is giving us one hell of a senior year! The dude can almost do it all. He could lead us in scoring every night if we gave him the chance to.


----------



## meistro

BallyPie said:


> I wonder who is having the bigger meltdown.....this message board or IU's message board....



I understand where you're coming from, but I don't give a shit what is going on with the IU message board. I'm so pissed with how bad we played I could spit. I can understand getting beat if you play hard and give it all you have, but we didn't today. We weren't going after loose balls like they were and we just looked scared.


----------



## SycamoreStateofMind

Love Cummings - but when he is our best player as he has been this entire conference season that is not a good thing.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Bluethunder said:


> The only thing that matters now is making sure this game only ends up as one loss.  We get it over with, go to Loyola on Wednesday and get a win.  If we sit around feeling sorry for ourselves and cause this hangover to let us play this bad at Loyola, then we let it beat us twice.
> 
> Lose by 2, or lose by 102, it is still a loss.  Just can't let it get in our head and cause us to lose again, and again, and again.
> 
> We are still 5-1 in the conference and 14-4 overall, and everyone but Wichita State would gladly trade places with us.
> 
> You play 30 some games in a season, you have days like this.  WSU is better than us, period.  Are they this much better than us, no, but again, it only counts as one loss.
> 
> Learn a little from it, put it out of your head and start winning again.  This loss is not a big deal (we all had this down as a loss), but losing Wednesday would be a killer.
> 
> Lets see how we respond.



You are exactly right.  There are a lot of posts on here that just don't get it and can't see beyond one game.  The fact is, WSU has always had better players than us.  Anybody remember the X man or Antoine Carr?  I'm not sure our '79 team could have won that game today.  We have been beaten badly before and it won't be the last.  What we need to do is win all of the games that we should win and try WSU again at our place.


----------



## SamWild

sycamorebacker said:


> Duh!  Nobody on here has said we are strong inside.  And it has nothing to do with the strength coach and everything to do with the players that we have.



Disagree! Look at Gant and the posts on here about him being recruited to the Big 10. He is a big body who has gained little muscle since coming to ISU. Look at the bodies of WSU and the fact that EVERYONE on their team was stronger than anyone for ISU. Strength plays a huge role in this.

Positives......Cummings made some shots, no one got hurt, Odum made 500th free throw.


----------



## sycamorebacker

SycamoreStateofMind said:


> Love Cummings - but when he is our best player as he has been this entire conference season that is not a good thing.



I knew he was playing well, but if you watch the highlights of the MSU game it is very obvious how well he is playing.


----------



## ISUCC

Frustrating thing about this game is we've basically had 2 chances to make statements on the road this year, this game and at St. Louis, and in both games we totally got our a$$es handed to us. 

If we had made respectable showings and lost by 6 or less points I'd think a little differently about this team, but thankfully we won't have such a soft schedule next year and will be better tested in the pre MVC portion of the schedule. 

these guys need to man up and get with it, or we're gonna be looking at the same ol' February collapse we've seen the past 2 seasons.


----------



## BudDawgII

As much as I like our Trees I have to ask----Who on this team has that fire in the belly competitive spirit?  Just seems like we need someone to really demonstrate some fighting pissed off attitude!


----------



## bent20

BudDawgII said:


> As much as I like our Trees I have to ask----Who on this team has that fire in the belly competitive spirit?  Just seems like we need someone to really demonstrate some fighting pissed off attitude!



The absence of leadership and a go-to scorer who can put the team on his back at times has always been an issue for this group of Sycamores. For as many problems as we had today, going from down nine to down twenty before we even scored a point in the second half is a pretty big one.


----------



## BallyPie

ISUCC said:


> Frustrating thing about this game is we've basically had 2 chances to make statements on the road this year, this game and at St. Louis, and in both games we totally got our a$$es handed to us.
> 
> If we had made respectable showings and lost by 6 or less points I'd think a little differently about this team, but thankfully we won't have such a soft schedule next year and will be better tested in the pre MVC portion of the schedule.
> 
> these guys need to man up and get with it, or we're gonna be looking at the same ol' February collapse we've seen the past 2 seasons.




You forgot about Notre Dame.....we did win that one..........schedules don't mean anything in regards to toughness IMO........Syracuse plays a weak ass non-conference schedule every year.....either you have the personnel to be physical inside or you don't.......

Our game is shooting the basketball....and we shot horribly today.......as someone said...it's one game....and should we beat these guys at home, everyone will forget about today's game.....


----------



## sycamorebacker

SamWild said:


> Disagree! Look at Gant and the posts on here about him being recruited to the Big 10. He is a big body who has gained little muscle since coming to ISU. Look at the bodies of WSU and the fact that EVERYONE on their team was stronger than anyone for ISU. Strength plays a huge role in this.
> 
> Positives......Cummings made some shots, no one got hurt, Odum made 500th free throw.



Gant has NEVER in his whole life been a physical player.  And you call him a big body?  Are we talking about the same guy?


----------



## Southgrad07

BudDawgII said:


> As much as I like our Trees I have to ask----Who on this team has that fire in the belly competitive spirit?  Just seems like we need someone to really demonstrate some fighting pissed off attitude!



That's the thing. We don't have anyone who wants to just kick your ass out there. One of our biggest problem is we don't have anyone who takes to the fight to other team, and that gets us in big trouble when we play physical  teams like St. Louis and Wichita. That team we played today is not top 10 talent wise, but what they have over us is a competitive spirit. They have that junk yard dog mentality.

 If you ask me it starts from the head man down. I think Lansing has done great things with our program, don't get me wrong. I just cant stand when he says things like " we could play well and still get beat". He says it all the time when we play the Wichita's or Creighton's.  This team looked scared today and saying things like that reflect that attitude.


----------



## Bluethunder

BallyPie said:


> You forgot about Notre Dame.....we did win that one..........schedules don't mean anything in regards to toughness IMO........Syracuse plays a weak ass non-conference schedule every year.....either you have the personnel to be physical inside or you don't.......
> 
> Our game is shooting the basketball....and we shot horribly today.......as someone said...it's one game....and should we beat these guys at home, everyone will forget about today's game.....



Agreed.  The reason the Belmont loss wasnt as bad as it first appeared is because we knew we had a do over later, just like now.

Keep winning and lets see where we are when we play the Shockers again.  Maybe we will still have one loss in the conference and it will be a battle for first place, maybe we will have lost five conference games and it won't even matter?  Who knows right now.

Lets all piss and moan tonight and get it out of our system, then start thinking positive and start a new winning streak on Wednesday.  If we hold on to this and keep rehashing it for the next few days we will just end up with another loss, then the board can really melt down!

Teams play bad games, and rarely do bad games happen at the right time.  Remember last year when the shockers lost at Southern Illinois and Evansville? There were people on their board saying the team sucked, didn't have a chance at the NCAA, CBI here we come, etc.  How did that situation work out?  

One game at a time, take it one game at a time.  I will be *damned* if I will let one game ruin this great season, especially against the shockers.  I just pray the team feels the same way.


----------



## IndyTreeFan

My only comments (as if anyone cares), and then I'm forgetting about this game.

1.  This should put to rest any question about who is the best PG in the MVC.  He doesn't wear blue.  Not by a long shot.
2.  We looked like a deer in headlights all day.  I cannot understand that.  Veteran team?  Today, they looked like a junior high b-team.
3.  We had better find a big who can play.
4.  We had better find a leader.  We don't have one.  We'd better get one, fast.
5.  It's only one game.  Yeah, it sucks that it was on national TV.  But it was just one game.  Gentlemen, let it burn for a while, but tomorrow, you've got to start getting ready for Loyola.  Remember, you're 14-4, 5-1.  You are not 4-14, 1-5.  Play like it.
6.  Get them back in Terre Haute.  If you don't have enough motivation to correct everything you did wrong and make *them* look like the junior high b-team, please leave because you have no fire.  I bet I know what you've got in you.  Time to show it to the rest of the league.

I'm going to watch something funny now.  I've cried enough for one day...


----------



## Bluethunder

Southgrad07 said:


> That's the thing. We don't have anyone who wants to just kick your ass out there. One of our biggest problem is we don't have anyone who takes to the fight to other team, and that gets us in big trouble when we play physical  teams like St. Louis and Wichita. That team we played today is not top 10 talent wise, but what they have over us is a competitive spirit. They have that junk yard dog mentality.
> 
> If you ask me it starts from the head man down. I think Lansing has done great things with our program, don't get me wrong. I just cant stand when he says things like " we could play well and still get beat". He says it all the time when we play the Wichita's or Creighton's.  This team looked scared today and saying things like that reflect that attitude.



To take your point one step further, how often do you see Lansing with fire in his belly?  How often do you see him in a game show some passion and fire?  Ever seem him take off the jacket?  Ever see him stomp the floor or clap harder than a golf clap when we need a defensive stop or when we are on a run?  Im not saying that he should turn into a raving lunatic, but if teams reflect their coach, then who could be surprised we lost today?  I don't think GL has ever done or said one thing that would be considered "edgy" or "brash".


----------



## Southgrad07

Bluethunder said:


> Agreed.  The reason the Belmont loss wasnt as bad as it first appeared is because we knew we had a do over later, just like now.
> 
> Keep winning and lets see where we are when we play the Shockers again.  Maybe we will still have one loss in the conference and it will be a battle for first place, maybe we will have lost five conference games and it won't even matter?  Who knows right now.
> 
> Lets all piss and moan tonight and get it out of our system, then start thinking positive and start a new winning streak on Wednesday.  If we hold on to this and keep rehashing it for the next few days we will just end up with another loss, then the board can really melt down!
> 
> Teams play bad games, and rarely do bad games happen at the right time.  Remember last year when the shockers lost at Southern Illinois and Evansville? There were people on their board saying the team sucked, didn't have a chance at the NCAA, CBI here we come, etc.  How did that situation work out?
> 
> One game at a time, take it one game at a time.  I will be *damned* if I will let one game ruin this great season, especially against the shockers.  I just pray the team feels the same way.



Season is far from over, I agree. This performance does show that we have to improve quite a bit to get to where we want to go. The league is not very good this year. Wichita is our only barometer when it comes to the NCAA's. I will put this one behind me come tomorrow, but until Feb. 5th I will be watching to see if we close the gap on them.


----------



## BallyPie

I think a few of you guys are being a little too harsh on our guys.....they want to win as badly as we want them to win.....sometimes you don't make shots and things snowball..........

I wonder if Creighton's message board was like this after we ran them out of HC last year........."McDermott isn't tough enough"....."Gibbs didn't show any leadership"......LOL......


----------



## BudDawgII

Agree with most on here.  The game is over and we sucked big time on a national stage!  
Our next game against Loyola will tell us a lot!  I hope its a team with an attitude on the road---I want to see this team come out and play with an attitude for forty minutes!


----------



## meistro

bent20 said:


> The absence of leadership and a go-to scorer who can put the team on his back at times has always been an issue for this group of Sycamores. For as many problems as we had today, going from down nine to down twenty before we even scored a point in the second half is a pretty big one.



I think Dawon, Arop and Smith are our go to scorers. Unfortunately, Smith and Arop couldn't throw it in the ocean today. I keep waiting for JO to take over, but it's just not happening. Maybe his injuries are taking a toll. I hope this was just a one game thing and we get it going next Wed.


----------



## MikeShox

Hey guys and gals, I am totally shocked at how the game went today. I expected a win, but also expected it to be a very tough game. I fully expected Tekele Cotton to be on Jake and Tekele always gives his opponent nightmares, but occasionally he might get into foul trouble too, and that didn't happen today. 

I know how hard a loss like this is to take. Believe me, we've had plenty of them here. I'll never forget last year when we made an Illinois State - Indiana States swing and won at Illinois State when we were down 7 with 40 seconds to go, then won at Indiana State and the fans figured we had it made. Then we came home and got beat by Evansville. 

Let's face it, your team had a horrible game today. That does not mean that they cannot regroup and get it together. I expect the Sycamores to come back with a vengeance against Loyola and continue that way. I also expect a much tougher game when our Shox head for Terre Haute Feb 5th. 

Hang in there, take a deep breath and keep playing well. I really want you to join us in the NCAA Tournament this year.


----------



## Bluethunder

MikeShox said:


> I really want you to join us in the NCAA Tournament this year.



You and me both


----------



## IndyTreeFan

Thanks!  You have quite a team.  Hopefully our guys give the Shocks a little payback on Feb. 5!


----------



## GuardShock

IndyTreeFan said:


> Thanks!  You have quite a team.  Hopefully our guys give the Shocks a little payback on Feb. 5!



I like when things turn positive. It was just one game. I sure don't see a reason why we can't win all the way until Feb 5th. What I do need to see is improvement at the post because we had nothing today.


----------



## TreeTop

GuardShock said:


> I like when things turn positive. It was just one game. I sure don't see a reason why we can't win all the way until Feb 5th. What I do need to see is improvement at the post because we had nothing today.



Concise.  And true!


----------



## bigsportsfan

cubbypike13 said:


> We responded with a seven game winning streak after that. So I hope we have the same response.



Against nobody any good.


----------



## sycamorebacker

bigsportsfan said:


> Against nobody any good.



Any conference win is good and any road win is great.  

So now we are to the point where we are not satisfied with winning games?


----------



## BudDawgII

sycamorebacker said:


> Any conference win is good and any road win is great.
> 
> So now we are to the point where we are not satisfied with winning games?



------once again you are missing the point!
Dude---he is talking about --SOS--and that meaningless wins are like shitting in your pants--it might feel warm and make you feel good for a minute---but is short term then gets messy and nasty!
Dude---you say we don't need a coach for our big men that they either have it or they don't or they can go to a church gym with their wife this afternoon and develop their own talents!
Dude---you have stated over and over--that if and when we have a "hot hand" shooter that we need to take him out of the game and let him cool down before he goes cold out on the floor!
Seriously, are you just trying to say stupid shit to get a reaction from us!


----------



## bigsportsfan

sycamorebacker said:


> Any conference win is good and any road win is great.
> 
> So now we are to the point where we are not satisfied with winning games?



No, I didn't say that. All I'm saying is that I'm not doing handstands over a six-game winning streak when it was over six teams we should have beaten regardless of the location. Had St. Louis or Wichita been a part of such a streak, it would be a little different.


----------



## gostate03

bigsportsfan said:


> No, I didn't say that. All I'm saying is that I'm not doing handstands over a six-game winning streak when it was over six teams we should have beaten regardless of the location. Had St. Louis or Wichita been a part of such a streak, it would be a little different.



I would gladly take another 6 game win streak, anytime you win 6 straight in the Valley you are doing something right, regardless of who you are playing!


----------



## Jason Svoboda

bigsportsfan said:


> Against nobody any good.



Sorry, this is ludicrous.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

BudDawgII said:


> ------once again you are missing the point!
> Dude---he is talking about --SOS--and that meaningless wins are like shitting in your pants--it might feel warm and make you feel good for a minute---but is short term then gets messy and nasty!
> Dude---you say we don't need a coach for our big men that they either have it or they don't or they can go to a church gym with their wife this afternoon and develop their own talents!
> Dude---you have stated over and over--that if and when we have a "hot hand" shooter that we need to take him out of the game and let him cool down before he goes cold out on the floor!
> Seriously, are you just trying to say stupid shit to get a reaction from us!



The SOS is an extremely flawed stat to hang your hat on. Fools gold even.


----------



## sycamorebacker

BudDawgII said:


> ------once again you are missing the point!
> Dude---he is talking about --SOS--and that meaningless wins are like shitting in your pants--it might feel warm and make you feel good for a minute---but is short term then gets messy and nasty!
> Dude---you say we don't need a coach for our big men that they either have it or they don't or they can go to a church gym with their wife this afternoon and develop their own talents!
> Dude---you have stated over and over--that if and when we have a "hot hand" shooter that we need to take him out of the game and let him cool down before he goes cold out on the floor!
> Seriously, are you just trying to say stupid shit to get a reaction from us!



No, I'm dead serious. 
1)  Who invented this SOS stuff.  A win is a win, especially in the conference.  Where I come from the goal is to win the conference. 
2)  I don't believe players need a "big man coach."  That is correct.  Most of it is instinct and there ain't nothing the head coach can't teach you.
     When you see good big men and bad big men, it's not a function of their coach --  it's talent. 
3)  You twisted the "hot hand" thing a bit.  I said designating a player has having a hot hand is about the past and does not predict his next shot.
     So you would not leave a tired player in because he has a hot hand.  Studies have shown that the success of the previous shot does not predict 
     the success of the next shot.


----------



## Gotta Hav

Jason Svoboda said:


> The SOS is an extremely flawed stat to hang your hat on. Fools gold even.



Are you saying the NCAA Selection Committee doesn't look at that, at all?   If it's Fools Gold, then why does it exist?  

Isn't that like saying, they don't use real data and facts like a teams Good Wins and Bad Losses, or Good Home Wins, and really Bad Road Losses?


----------



## sycamorebacker

Gotta Hav said:


> Are you saying the NCAA Selection Committee doesn't look at that, at all?   If it's Fools Gold, then why does it exist?
> 
> Isn't that like saying, they don't use real data and facts like a teams Good Wins and Bad Losses, or Good Home Wins, and really Bad Road Losses?



They are supposed to use ALL of the information plus see teams play, I believe.  All of the stuff like RPI are flawed.  The best is Sagarin, because it is a model that correlates the scores.  But it is not perfect and I don't know if the selection committee uses it. 
I wish people would stop treating the NCAA tournament like the holy grail.  I want to finish at the top of the conference every year.  Screw the NCAA.  You just have to play your best and let the chips fall. 
 It gripes me that the big schools can play all of the cupcakes AT HOME and they don't have to worry about SOS.


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Gotta Hav said:


> Are you saying the NCAA Selection Committee doesn't look at that, at all?   If it's Fools Gold, then why does it exist?
> 
> Isn't that like saying, they don't use real data and facts like a teams Good Wins and Bad Losses, or Good Home Wins, and really Bad Road Losses?



Yes, it's just like the RPI. In the RPI calcs, your opponents opponents record accounts for 25% of the equation. In SOS it accounts for 33%. Do you really think it is good to hang your hat on the records of who your opponents play?

SOS is calculated by taking 2 * (Opponents Records) + Opponents Opponents Record / 3. 
RPI is calculated by taking 0.25 * (Winning Pct) + 0.5 * (Opponents Winning Pct) + 0.25 * (Opponents Opponents Winning Pct)

So while I don't mind people using them as a basis of reference, people get way too hung up on them.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Jason Svoboda said:


> Yes, it's just like the RPI. In the RPI calcs, your opponents opponents record accounts for 25% of the equation. In SOS it accounts for 33%. Do you really think it is good to hang your hat on the records of who your opponents play?
> 
> SOS is calculated by taking 2 * (Opponents Records) + Opponents Opponents Record / 3.
> RPI is calculated by taking 0.25 * (Winning Pct) + 0.5 * (Opponents Winning Pct) + 0.25 * (Opponents Opponents Winning Pct)
> 
> So while I don't mind people using them as a basis of reference, people get way too hung up on them.



Thanks.
I didn't know the exact calc, but it looks like garbage to me.  I hope the committee doesn't treat it like the gospel -- and I don't think they do.


----------



## BudDawgII

Jason Svoboda said:


> The SOS is an extremely flawed stat to hang your hat on. Fools gold even.



Not hanging my hat on it.  Simply saying --when you have a weak conference --which we do "this year" and you combine that  with the weak non conference schedule we had--it will result in a great record but not a record that is an accurate indicator of the team "your record" indicates you have!
Why I mentioned yesterday that teams like St Louis and WS that are solid overall teams pull our pants down and expose us for either what we are or how we measure up against solid teams.
I'm convinced we have some solid players ---I'm yet to be convinced that we have a solid "team" that can hold its own against solid teams!


----------



## sycamorebacker

BudDawgII said:


> -I'm yet to be convinced that we have a solid "team" that can hold its own against solid teams!



I definitely agree with this.  We have some areas that are weak and some are not going to be corrected this year.  In other words, we are what we are.  I think our defense is much better now but the problem with that is a good opponent will respond with good defense.  So that will put pressure on our shooting and expose our weaknesses.  Every game is going to be a dogfight for us -- I just hope we can play nearly as well as we can most of the time. 
At 5-1 though, I have to say, it ain't perfect, but winning is more fun than losing.


----------



## bluebill

Agree winning is more fun, but I guess what I saw yesterday was that we didn't play so badly, as the fact that we were taken out of our game totally by a team that played as good a game as I have seen in a long time.  Our effgort was there and the "D" was respectable for the most part, but Shock's contested every move we made successfully.  A VERY good game played by the Shockers, they are real.:embarassed:





sycamorebacker said:


> I definitely agree with this.  We have some areas that are weak and some are not going to be corrected this year.  In other words, we are what we are.  I think our defense is much better now but the problem with that is a good opponent will respond with good defense.  So that will put pressure on our shooting and expose our weaknesses.  Every game is going to be a dogfight for us -- I just hope we can play nearly as well as we can most of the time.
> At 5-1 though, I have to say, it ain't perfect, but winning is more fun than losing.


----------



## Bluethunder

The easiest way to look at all of it is this,....the committee will use whatever metrics they want that make the big schools look good and will use whatever numbers they need to as an excuse to keep smaller schools like us out.

As someone on here said, BCS schools can play 14 out of conference games, have ten of them at home (9 of which are against teams from the bottom five conferences) have the other four on neutral floors and then go 9-9 in their conference and call it a succesful year because the won 23 games.

Meanwhile, we have to go on the road to get a top 100 match up, and unless we go around 10-2 out of conference, then we must go about 14-4 in the conference, no matter how good or bad our conference is that year.

I will give you a really good example, Creighton.  Creighton has (I believe) only played five true road games so far this year.  They played last night at Providence and got their ass kicked, losing the entire game and the final score was actually closer than most of the game. Yet, they are ranked #20 in the country.  Will anyone think twice about them being a good team because they lost by double digits at Providence?  No.  Yet we lost by double digits at WSU (a much better team that Providence) and everyone is afraid the pundits will say "ah we suck", don't deserve the tourney, etc.

One more thing to keep in mind, have some of you looked at some of the BCS conferences?  Nothing to write home about.  The SEC has a few teams, but otherwise isn't that impressive.  Same for the Big East, same for the Big 12.  They have three or four teams that are solid, but otherwise they aren't nearly as strong as the media and the polls would have you believe.

Just my two cents.  Feel free to destroy my thoughts with your rebuttals......


----------



## BallyPie

I think people are putting to much emphasis on the St Louis and WS losses in evaluating our team.....keep in mind....these were ROAD losses....even good teams lose on the road......and we do have a decent road win at Notre Dame......so....having said that.....yeah....I wish we would have made a better game of it yesterday.......but regardless if we lost by 1 point or 20 points yesterday, I still think we have the same chance of beating WS at home as I did before yesterday's game.....


----------



## Sycamore Proud

A loss to Easter Ill or Loyola would have hurt much more the SLU or WSU did. We have a chance to redeem yesterday's loss in the Haute. And I personally look forward to getting them in Arch Madness, especially if they get us Feb. 5.


----------



## BallyPie

This road loss was probably the worst showing on the road by an ISU team since 3 years ago when we went to Wyoming and got blown out by 30 points......on the positive side......we recovered from that loss  and went on to win Arch Madness and go the NCAAs..........just sayin'...


----------



## BudDawgII

Here is the bottom line---IMO---it is now nut cutting time!  Over the next two weeks we have four conference games--(3) on the road --Loyola--Southern IL--Northern Iowa and (1) at home--IL State!  I firmly believe how we play over the next two weeks will answer my questions concerning this team.  Thus this stretch will tell me what I need to know prior to the WS big game at HC!
How will we respond to this stretch on the road---especially after an ass kicking on national tv?
Yes--the WS game in two and a half weeks is what a lot of folks are talking about but I'm more interested in what happens before that game.  
We are at that point where by now there is enough MVC tape and the coaches and players know each teams strengths and weaknesses.
If not now--the next two weeks---well-we won't have to ask when.  If not the next two weeks ---its not going to be much fun in Feb/March!


----------



## Jason Svoboda

Lansing takes more blame for his team’s play than any coach I’ve been around consistently. It’s an endearing trait to see a coach protect his team as much as possible, even if it’s not always his fault, and it works as long as the fans don’t begin to believe it too much. “We’ve been talking for about a month about listening and getting better on a daily basis, and we haven’t done that,” he said. “The slippage is probably my fault. I’ll certainly have their attention now.” Lansing turned an unstable situation into a stable one with a lot of good work in Terre Haute. It’s the second-smallest city in the MVC and Indiana State’s enrollment of 11,494 is the smallest of the conference’s public schools. The Sycamores don’t play guarantee games at home, so they go on the road more than most. Lansing took over from Kevin McKenna in 2011 and has produced three winning seasons. Before Lansing, the Sycamores hadn’t had three straight since 1998-2001. As long as Lansing is around, it appears Indiana State will be an upper-level MVC team.


Read more here: http://blogs.kansas.com/shockwaves/#storylink=cpy


----------



## sycamorebacker

BallyPie said:


> This road loss was probably the worst showing on the road by an ISU team since 3 years ago when we went to Wyoming and got blown out by 30 points......on the positive side......we recovered from that loss  and went on to win Arch Madness and go the NCAAs..........just sayin'...



You should look back at some of our losses in 2000 and 2001.


----------



## Bluethunder

So the question is (after reading the blog post above) do the players respond to Lansing and his methods?  What I mean is, do they see him taking bullets for them and say "this is on us, not him, we need to do this for us and for coach" and get inspired, or do they look at this and say "glad coach is here to take so many bullets for us" and they can relax?  Would putting the screws to them work better? Would pulling a Barry Hinson cause them to respond forcefully?

I don't know the answer and I leave it to the coaches that spend so much time with the kids to know which approach is best in any situation, but I have often wondered if GL's constant habit of putting everything negative on himself and the coaching staff can have the opposite intended effect after so long.

Thoughts?


----------



## BudDawgII

Jason Svoboda said:


> Lansing takes more blame for his team’s play than any coach I’ve been around consistently. It’s an endearing trait to see a coach protect his team as much as possible, even if it’s not always his fault, and it works as long as the fans don’t begin to believe it too much. “We’ve been talking for about a month about listening and getting better on a daily basis, and we haven’t done that,” he said. “The slippage is probably my fault. I’ll certainly have their attention now.” Lansing turned an unstable situation into a stable one with a lot of good work in Terre Haute. It’s the second-smallest city in the MVC and Indiana State’s enrollment of 11,494 is the smallest of the conference’s public schools. The Sycamores don’t play guarantee games at home, so they go on the road more than most. Lansing took over from Kevin McKenna in 2011 and has produced three winning seasons. Before Lansing, the Sycamores hadn’t had three straight since 1998-2001. As long as Lansing is around, it appears Indiana State will be an upper-level MVC team.
> 
> 
> Read more here: http://blogs.kansas.com/shockwaves/#storylink=cpy


LMAO----hell its easy to take the blame and play the role of the knight in shining armour--that will carry this teams faults on his shoulders---when you have a 4 to 5 yr contract!  No adjustments were made during the second half on Sat---who is to blame?  I'm sick and tired of hearing that he is a players coach---excuse me while I go puke!:barf:


----------



## sycamorebacker

BudDawgII said:


> LMAO----hell its easy to take the blame and play the role of the knight in shining armour--that will carry this teams faults on his shoulders---when you have a 4 to 5 yr contract!  No adjustments were made during the second half on Sat---who is to blame?  I'm sick and tired of hearing that he is a players coach---excuse me while I go puke!:barf:



Congratulations!  One of the worst and most negative posts I've ever seen on here.


----------



## sycamorebacker

Bluethunder said:


> So the question is (after reading the blog post above) do the players respond to Lansing and his methods?  What I mean is, do they see him taking bullets for them and say "this is on us, not him, we need to do this for us and for coach" and get inspired, or do they look at this and say "glad coach is here to take so many bullets for us" and they can relax?  Would putting the screws to them work better? Would pulling a Barry Hinson cause them to respond forcefully?
> 
> I don't know the answer and I leave it to the coaches that spend so much time with the kids to know which approach is best in any situation, but I have often wondered if GL's constant habit of putting everything negative on himself and the coaching staff can have the opposite intended effect after so long.
> 
> Thoughts?



When a team plays poorly that's just a part of athletics.  But if someone has to be "blamed" then I think it falls on the team.  And you have to move on.  I see nothing wrong with Coach saying the team played poorly.  They know it.


----------



## BrokerZ

Bluethunder said:


> So the question is (after reading the blog post above) do the players respond to Lansing and his methods?  What I mean is, do they see him taking bullets for them and say "this is on us, not him, we need to do this for us and for coach" and get inspired, or do they look at this and say "glad coach is here to take so many bullets for us" and they can relax?  Would putting the screws to them work better? Would pulling a Barry Hinson cause them to respond forcefully?
> 
> I don't know the answer and I leave it to the coaches that spend so much time with the kids to know which approach is best in any situation, but I have often wondered if GL's constant habit of putting everything negative on himself and the coaching staff can have the opposite intended effect after so long.
> 
> Thoughts?



I think Lansing was rightfully tough on his players when he did his post-game interview on the radio on WIBQ.  I switched over to the radio after watching the game on ESPN2 so I could hear Lansing's comments.  He made it very clear that he thought the players played selfishly and was critical of their execution.  He may have taken the bulk of the blame with the media in the press conference, but his initial reaction was very appropriate.  

He was tough on the players without calling anyone out individually, which is exactly how he should have handled it.  Choosing that moment to pull a "Barry Hinson" would have been the exact opposite thing to do.  Lansing seems like the kind of coach that says the right things to the media, but I feel pretty confident that the players will get their share in practice this week.


----------



## Bluethunder

BudDawgII said:


> LMAO----hell its easy to take the blame and play the role of the knight in shining armour--that will carry this teams faults on his shoulders---when you have a 4 to 5 yr contract!  No adjustments were made during the second half on Sat---who is to blame?  I'm sick and tired of hearing that he is a players coach---excuse me while I go puke!:barf:



I wouldn't say NO adjustments were made.  Wasn't it the second or third possession of the second half where we called a set play and Gant had a layup that he missed?  Not trying to put it on Gant, but adjustments only go so far when you can't put the rubber ball through the metal hoop.


----------



## BudDawgII

sycamorebacker said:


> Congratulations!  One of the worst and most negative posts I've ever seen on here.



Thanks Backer---means a lot coming from you!  Guess I wasn't aware that we were not suppose to offer up anything that you don't consider positive or worthy.  Maybe next time I should send you a PM ahead of time and get your pre--approval!
I'm not in the happy/feel good business but call it the way I see it!


----------



## SycamoreLynch

Greetings Sycamore Pride!

I have returned back to Terredice.  What a road trip.  I knew Wichita was 600+ miles away from here but it felt like we were in the car FOR. EVER.  Solid 10+ hours to get there.  Thanks to Coach Lansing for helping us with hotel rooms this weekend.  He was able to put us in the Marriott with the team and other ISU'ers who were there.  Had fantastic conversation with Matt Renn and Todd Golden Friday night.  Getting to hear Matt talk about the culture around here during their success years.

I could write a book but it's nothing we don't already know.  Wichita State University has one of the best fan bases in all of college sports.  I can't believe how "trained" for a lack of better term, they are when it comes to the games.  Their "black or gold" scheme was executed to perfection.  The fans knew what to, when to cheer, and everyone was together the whole night.   My first take away (I took thousands of mental notes) they don't "cheer and chant" a lot.  They clap.  ALOT.  Every single time the ball went through the hoops for WSU they crowd simply went bonkers.  Standing. Clapping. Yelling.  

At the start of both halves, every one was on their feet.  No one in the Roundhouse thought about sitting down until both team score.  In the first half we scored first then WSU.  Second half, well they all stood the first 8 minutes of the game until we finally got a FG.  Their fan base is dedicated and committed to the program. I'm not getting on here to point fingers or call names.  I'm just trying to create that here.  The best term I can use is to "train" the crowd.  Stand at the start.  Clap together.  Clap loud. Yell a little.   We need to get everyone inside Hulman Center on the same page. 

I was so envious of their promotional videos and graphics.  Again, I'm not pointing fingers or wanting to blame anyone that works on our side but all their videos and graphics were clean and attention grabbing.  Some of their promotional time out events were neat.  Others were as bad as our tic tac toe game.  One of their little games was shooting free throws with tied up news papers.  Simply weird.  

Another things they did I thought was really cool.  A majority of their staff in the roundhouse was student athletics from other sports.  The baseball team, in their baseball unis were ushers at the entrances directing us to our seats.  For all promo events the softball team, in softball unis were out there helping set up and tear down if need be. 

I've heard that the crowd noise didn't come through the TV very well.  Granted WSU has a hell of a game against a great opponent who didn't play well (us), that place was extremely loud the entire time.  So many people non-students were the ones standing up and getting the clapping going together.  The students and the non-students fed of one another.  

One a great side note, my buddies and I were their jumbo tron pre game.  They do a "what not to wear" at a WSU game on the screens.  Showed people who didn't wear black or gold (I would love to do that at HC) they showed us in our Forest shirts and I thought the place was going to come after us.  In honesty though that leads me into one of my biggest points of the entire experience.  There wasn't a single person that was rude to us in any way.  We were decked out in ISU sweatshirts and our Forest t shirts.  Many people approached us and asked if we flew in.  When we told them we drove they were interested in how far the trip was and had mature conversation.  We even wondered in their tiny bookstore (it's in their union which is being completely redone) and a guy kept complementing Odum and our squad as a whole.  He was confident it would come down to the end of the game.  If any Wichita fans are on here and read my novel of a post, kudos to the hospitality you treated my friends and I to while we were on campus and at the game.

Like said, we took a ton of notes.  The Forest and the new-era Sycamore Pride that is slowing being installed around here is going to be a long work in progress.  Wichita has it figured out.  It's amazing when the masterpiece comes together.  Be sure to get your tickets for Feb. 5th and make sure we do our best to return the favor to them when they make the trip up here for the rematch.

p.s. I never did find the state of Wichita.  This game was placed in a town called Wichita.  

SycLynch


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## Divergence

SycamoreLynch said:


> If any Wichita fans are on here and read my novel of a post, kudos to the hospitality you treated my friends and I to while we were on campus and at the game.



My perspective is 99% fans are decent folks who just want to see their program do well.  In STL I have ate many a breakfast with fans of other teams are very hospitable and had very civil conversation. Even sat at table last year outnumbered by some ISUR fans and there were no kicks to our chest.  

There has only been one fan base I had some negativity with - and that was with CU.  They were generally just rude.


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## rapala

I'll bet you were eating at chili Macs


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## rapala

Great post Tom.  I have found most Valley fans are pretty good sports.  ITF and I have had great times at the tourney.


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## Bluethunder

Divergence said:


> My perspective is 99% fans are decent folks who just want to see their program do well.  In STL I have ate many a breakfast with fans of other teams are very hospitable and had very civil conversation. Even sat at table last year outnumbered by some ISUR fans and there were no kicks to our chest.
> 
> There has only been one fan base I had some negativity with - and that was with CU.  They were generally just rude.



I know last year I was pleasantly surprised that when we beat the shockers in wichita how much credit they gave us.  Many of them talked about they had been flat out beat, out hustled, etc.  Fast forward to Feb when we demolished Creighton, absolutely no credit.  It was all about how they played so poorly, they did this wrong, they did that wrong, excuses excuses excuses.  Even though I am not crazy about shockers fans, I ALWAYS pulled for the shockers over Creighton.  I do not, nor will ever miss creighton and their fan base.  I noticed a creighton thread, i will not even look at it, because I don't give a darn about them unless it involves them losing a game.


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## POGO

Wichita State grad here and I would like to respond to Sycamore Lynch's observations during his trip to Doo Dah. (A whimsical nickname for Wichita)  First I am glad he was treated well by our fans.  I believe most of our visitors are treated like they were unless they bring an attitude like the school that left the MoValley and shall remain nameless.  Our videos and promotions have only recently (as in the last two years) become as polished and engaging.  Our marketing people have started using outside production types to help and have hired a marketing group to help with the brand.  Not all the new stuff has been received universally but for the most part it is going really well.  The last big thing for the ISU game was to stripe "the Chuck" ie Charles Koch arena.  They left leaflets on every seat at the game prior to the ISU game explaining what color each section was to wear.  Of course on Shocker Net most felt that this would be an epic fail since no one would comply unless shirts were left on each seat for the game.  I was overwhelmed at the sight that except for a few hundred scattered about over 10,000 people had got it right.  Who says our reading skills aren't good?  The "What not to wear to the game" sequence they run was initially aimed at the people that would wear ku or kstate gear to the game and believe me by singling out those folks has put a damper on that activity.  Your guys really took it well when they made the video board.  Another one is one about "Don't leave early" where they have a student trying to sneak out and WU stalks him and tackles the guy and drags him back into the arena.  He was right in his observation that we don't orchestrate a lot of chants or cheers but we do stand and clap for DEFENSE at the start of each half.  We only sit once the other team has made a basket. (Free throws don't count)  During the Randy Smithson era we stood and clapped for offense and sometimes we stood for a long time for some of these offense challenged teams.  The students stand the whole game because they are young and can.  The rest of us will get back to our feet if the team needs encouragement. Just a spontaneous thing.  Hope he has some good ideas about how to engage the ISU fan base and students.  The Valley needs several teams that play at a high level and ISU I would think should be one of them.  Good luck the rest of the way except when our two teams meet.  My thoughts on the game.....I was never comfortable with our lead until the 12 minute mark in 2nd half.


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## RoyalShock

I would also add that the involvement of the baseball and softball teams isn't a typical thing.  The baseball team was handing out pocket baseball schedules and the softball team was covering the for the primary spirit squad, as they were at some cheerleading competition.  Also, the newspaper free throw promotion was because the Wichita Eagle was the game sponsor.  It's a one-time thing.

I was hoping to run into the four ISU students to compliment them on having such dedication to make the longest road trip for them in the conference.  Well done, and thanks for the glowing report on Koch Arena!


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## SubGod22

Glad to hear SycamoreLynch was treated well and enjoyed his time at CKA. Outside of the score anyway. I was a little skeptical that we'd pull off the stripes at first, but then found out about the leaflets or whatever left on each seat at the prior game and figured it would turn out alright. I thought it was strictly a social media thing and knew that would be doomed to fail. 

I like that there's some enthusiasm and students trying to build something in TH. Hopefully it builds and you get the atmosphere you desire. That kind of stuff can go a long way in helping recruiting players and coaches and making a nice home court advantage. We need a couple of schools to rise up and I think you guys with Lansing have the potential to do that. 

Best of luck until our next meeting.


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## meistro

WTWO just had a nice segment featuring Sycamore Lynch and Coach Lansing. Great publicity. Great job Lynch! Keep up the good work.


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## rsperge

from a personal stand point, just wanted to say one thing,    here I was telling all my friends and family how good Indiana State is this year, and here on national TV, ESPN2, we get totally bombed, fell flat on our face, it was an embarrassment, give all the credit to the Shockers, great win, hopefully and I say hopefully, we can get them back on 2/5 at Hulman Center.


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## POGO

A short sidelight that has nothing to do with the topic (like many of my posts on SN) I was in the Marine Corps in '79 and attached to an Engineer Bn and a group of us would play basketball at lunch on the courts behind HQ.  One day a major saw my WSU shirt and said he was a grad of ISU.  From then on we would talk valley sports and he really enjoyed the year the Sycamores were having.  I believe he was XO of Radio Bn at that time.  Sorry don't remember his name but he and I had a great time talking about our respective schools.


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