Before season thread

[Patriot_Sycamore]

25 days until Rose Hulman exhibition and Im jacked !!

Couple of thoughts to hopefully get some chatter started

1. There is no doubt what this years team is supposed to do...no fuzzy thoughts....be in top 2 at end ofconference season....playing on Sunday in the MVC Tourney and meeting the fans in the REC Center to watch selection Sunday to see where we play. Anything short will be considered a let down. I hope the team embraces this and rises to the level they can play.

2. Jake...its his swan song.....send us out right. A large part of his legacy has been written...but the last chapter will put him on the pedestal with the all time great ISU names.....

3. Dawon- With RJ gone, need to see the shooting % increase to give us a consistent outside threat.

4. Manny...be under control Manny and he will be really good....don't force it, let the game come to you


5. Justin. Lets see another step up...especially in consistency. Big games and disappearing games.......Do what you do best. Be aggressive on offense and guard.. Gotta increase effort for rebounds

6. Khristian- Same as Manny...seems like when he let the game come to him he was real good.....

7. Kitch Be solid.....rebound with great effort...find a niche and make it yours

8. Devonte Don't force it......was good when he seemed to not try and go 100 mph....he was a RS Freshman.....Look to see him take a step up

9. Eital Do what you do...shoot with confidence.....

10 Demetrius Same as Kitch..haven't seen much of him but rebound with bad intentions....


boss is walking around.....lol Ill post more later


Go Sycamores

 

[treeman]

very good breakdown, my thoughts exactly on all of the players. reaching the NCAAs would solidify JO13 spot as one of ISU's all-time greats. he already has been a very good player for us for 3 years, but we will be talking about him for years and years if he takes us to 2 NCAAs. I expect Manny and Khristian to step up big time this season and make huge contributions (Manny has a very good shot at being 1st team all-conference) if he lets the game come to him. Gant seems to always improve and i believe is one of the more underrated players on our team and in the league because he isn't flashy. If Lucas can knock down the 3 consistently all season, he will be that player opposing fans hate. You stop Odum, you stop Arop, then there's this little guy hitting 3s on you...very frustrating for opposing teams. And for some reason I just have that feeling that Demetrius will be a BIG contributor for are team all season. Havn't seen him play but i heard he is very athletic and can hoop. This will either be a GREAT season or a TERRIBLE season absolutely no inbetween.

 

[IndyTreeFan]

My expectations for this team are higher than any team I've watched at ISU since Renn and Menser's senior year. Here's what I will consider successful, considering what they showed us last year (feel free to rip me for being to pollyanna-ish):

1. 23-25 wins
2. NCAA tournament bid sealed up before the MVC tournament
3. Top 2 in MVC
4. MVC tournament championship game appearance
5. Wins AT Notre Dame and St. Louis
6. Epic battles with Wichita State for supremacy in the MVC
7. Championship at the Great Alaska Shootout (or whatever tournament we're playing in up there...)

There. That's not asking too much, is it? :thinking:

 

[BlueSycamore]

Have not heard anything about last year redshirt frosh TJ Bell? Is he expected to contribute meaningful minutes this season? Would hope he is coming in "under the radar"...........................

 

[TreeTop]

1. 23-25 wins
2. NCAA tournament bid sealed up before the MVC tournament
3. Top 2 in MVC
4. MVC tournament championship game appearance
5. Wins AT Notre Dame and St. Louis
6. Epic battles with Wichita State for supremacy in the MVC
7. Championship at the Great Alaska Shootout (or whatever tournament we're playing in up there...)

These are not my expectations per se, but everything here is exactly what I'm feeling for this team.

And I'll throw in Odum and Arop first team All-MVC.

(Odum winning POY would be the icing on the cake, but I don't think it'll happen)

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

And for some reason I just have that feeling that Demetrius will be a BIG contributor for are team all season. Havn't seen him play but i heard he is very athletic and can hoop.

So you haven't actually seen him play, you've just heard he is athletic so you think he's going to have a "BIG" (ALL CAPS, you did it not me) season. Really?

I have a feeling the last two presidential elections were decided based on what people - mostly young people heard about said candidate not what they actually knew.

Here is an idea, don't create an expectation based on what you've "heard". Certainly don't call it a BIG season based on what you've heard because in doing so you've made your entire long post a waste of time because now I don't know what to believe.

Can you form your own opinion or all of what you said based on things that you have heard? It comments like this - about a player that members know nothing about that make me wonder.

Don't judge a book by its cover - in this case 99% of posters haven't even seen the cover. Lol
I have seen the cover and I've seen the inside admittidly only once and I think he has a ways to go before he makes any "BIG" contributions to this team. You heard right, he is big and athletic - no doubt based on that alone he can play this level. But he doesn't have much of a mid range game and he will be asked to guard hard in the Lansing system - how well he can defend and rebound will go a long way toward how much he plays. That and how well Kitch plays. Make no mistake they didn't bring in this kid to sit on the bench, but don't think because of what you heard that he doesn't have a long way to go. He sat out a year or organized hoops, it's not as simple as riding a bike as some would tend to think.

That is really all that needs to be said at this point.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Have not heard anything about last year redshirt frosh TJ Bell? Is he expected to contribute meaningful minutes this season? Would hope he is coming in "under the radar"...........................

Very much under the radar - I'm not sure Lansing wil need much from him this season with Gant, Kitch and the above mentioned BIG D - Bell probably falls in right behind those 3 guys so you hope he doesn't have to play big mins. But don't get me wrong he has certainly improved - the kid keeps growing into his body and should be a good one. Moves well - needs to be strong with the ball, lacks agressivness.

 

[TreeTop]

So you haven't actually seen him play, you've just heard he is athletic so you think he's going to have a "BIG" (ALL CAPS, you did it not me) season. Really?

Treeman said big contributor. I think there's a difference between saying a player will be a big contributor and saying a player will have a big season.

I saw on GoSycamores that his latest stats in JC, were 8points and 6rebounds a game. If he does this, I would consider it as a big contributor, but not a big season......as long as he's not a liability (on defense or in terms of turnovers for example).

 

[treeman]

So you haven't actually seen him play, you've just heard he is athletic so you think he's going to have a "BIG" (ALL CAPS, you did it not me) season. Really?

I have a feeling the last two presidential elections were decided based on what people - mostly young people heard about said candidate not what they actually knew.

Here is an idea, don't create an expectation based on what you've "heard". Certainly don't call it a BIG season based on what you've heard because in doing so you've made your entire long post a waste of time because now I don't know what to believe.

Can you form your own opinion or all of what you said based on things that you have heard? It comments like this - about a player that members know nothing about that make me wonder.

Don't judge a book by its cover - in this case 99% of posters haven't even seen the cover. Lol
I have seen the cover and I've seen the inside admittidly only once and I think he has a ways to go before he makes any "BIG" contributions to this team. You heard right, he is big and athletic - no doubt based on that alone he can play this level. But he doesn't have much of a mid range game and he will be asked to guard hard in the Lansing system - how well he can defend and rebound will go a long way toward how much he plays. That and how well Kitch plays. Make no mistake they didn't bring in this kid to sit on the bench, but don't think because of what you heard that he doesn't have a long way to go. He sat out a year or organized hoops, it's not as simple as riding a bike as some would tend to think.

That is really all that needs to be said at this point.

It's the off season, anything can happen throughout the season. NOBODY KNOWS how the year will unfold, not Lansing, not JO13, not Prettyman, no one. i posted what i think will happen this season and you can post what you think will happen this season.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

It's the off season, anything can happen throughout the season. NOBODY KNOWS how the year will unfold, not Lansing, not JO13, not Prettyman, no one. i posted what i think will happen this season and you can post what you think will happen this season.

Well that was profound, thank you for permission.

I woke up today and just decided to say that a player I know nothing about, have never seen play and have only heard things about is going to have a BIG season.

You tell me how educared that sounds. Some opinions are founded and some are based on nothing at all. I will let folks decide for themselves but I would guard against believing what you hear.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Treeman said big contributor. I think there's a difference between saying a player will be a big contributor and saying a player will have a big season.

You do? Show me the difference, I don't see much of a difference at all. Reguardless of a difference or not, it holds no weight at all.

I'm not making a perdiction that he will or won't do anything so don't misread. I am saying he has a long way to go before he puts up those #'s at this level.

 

[treeman]

have a BIG season.

if you are going to make the effort in quoting what i say (which you are by your capital "big") please actually quote me rather than saying what you think i said.

You also have to realize that realistically how much are we expecting from Demetrius this season? we have almost everyone returning from a good squad. if he doesn't play at all this season it's not going to be a huge surprise to most fans because we don't expect much if anything from a new JC player coming to a team with majority of pieces in place. That's no knock on Demetrius but we should have a really good team this year. now if he goes out there and averages 5-6 points with 2-3 rebounds a game would you consider that BIG contributions from a person with no expectations this season? I know i would. that's what i'm saying, not expecting him to fill out the stat sheets but i'm thinking that he will be a nice surprise for us.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

if you are going to make the effort in quoting what i say (which you are by your capital "big") please actually quote me rather than saying what you think i said.

You also have to realize that realistically how much are we expecting from Demetrius this season? we have almost everyone returning from a good squad. if he doesn't play at all this season it's not going to be a huge surprise to most fans because we don't expect much if anything from a new JC player coming to a team with majority of pieces in place. That's no knock on Demetrius but we should have a really good team this year. now if he goes out there and averages 5-6 points with 2-3 rebounds a game would you consider that BIG contributions from a person with no expectations this season? I know i would. that's what i'm saying, not expecting him to fill out the stat sheets but i'm thinking that he will be a nice surprise for us.

Fair enough but sounds a lot like back pedaling to me.

And to be clear, I would not define 5 points 2 rbs. BIG speaking in terms of impact which is clearly what you were talking about.

But on to more important things.

I expect Bell Cummings, Brown and Burnett all to take a step forward this season. Brown looks to be more physical and ready this season than in years past. He establised himself as a hard on the ball defender last year - I look for him to improve his D all around and likely be a starter along side Odum.

I have a hard time deciding on who should get more mins. between Brown and Cummings - both bring pros and cons to the table. Here is what we know, if Cummings can shoot the ball better and not turn the ball over he will be very impactful. If Brown can play D without fouling, play under control/not turn the ball over and make free throws he will be very impactful. I would expect - based on progression alone that both will improve.

My starting line-up is my under 2 min. Line-up for those that don't like starting line-ups:

PG. JO
SG. Brown
SF. Manny
PF. Smith
C. Gant

That is what I would start, here is what GL will do.

PG. JO
SG. Eitel
SF. Arop
PF. Gant
C. Kitch

Atleast to start the season - you can mix Eitel, Cummings and Brown at any time.

 

[Daveinth]

Fair enough but sounds a lot like back pedaling to me.

And to be clear, I would not define 5 points 2 rbs. BIG speaking in terms of impact which is clearly what you were talking about.

But on to more important things.

I expect Bell Cummings, Brown and Burnett all to take a step forward this season. Brown looks to be more physical and ready this season than in years past. He establised himself as a hard on the ball defender last year - I look for him to improve his D all around and likely be a starter along side Odum.

I have a hard time deciding on who should get more mins. between Brown and Cummings - both bring pros and cons to the table. Here is what we know, if Cummings can shoot the ball better and not turn the ball over he will be very impactful. If Brown can play D without fouling, play under control/not turn the ball over and make free throws he will be very impactful. I would expect - based on progression alone that both will improve.

My starting line-up is my under 2 min. Line-up for those that don't like starting line-ups:

PG. JO
SG. Brown
SF. Manny
PF. Smith
C. Gant

That is what I would start, here is what GL will do.

PG. JO
SG. Eitel
SF. Arop
PF. Gant
C. Kitch

Atleast to start the season - you can mix Eitel, Cummings and Brown at any time.

At homecoming I talked to Justin ( I know you find it hard to believe I could comprehend anything in the condition I was in LOL) I asked him in his opinion who is the guys who he thought had improved the most in the off season . He said Khristian Smith and Brandon Burnett, he seemed really high on both of these players as far as their contributions to the team this year . I think I will until pr oven wrong take the words on contributers of the guy who practices with these player everyday over any of these posts . I understand it is all perceptions and none of us have seen any of the new guys play at this level more than once or twice this year . I would however say that with the talent we have back this year that if a JC player was able to come in and give us 8 and 6 a night that it is a big season based solely on the amount of talent returning.

 

[sycamorebacker]

Very much under the radar - I'm not sure Lansing wil need much from him this season with Gant, Kitch and the above mentioned BIG D - Bell probably falls in right behind those 3 guys so you hope he doesn't have to play big mins. But don't get me wrong he has certainly improved - the kid keeps growing into his body and should be a good one. Moves well - needs to be strong with the ball, lacks agressivness.

Based on what i saw last year, Scott could be easily one of our most talented players. Have you seen him in practice?

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Based on what i saw last year, Scott could be easily one of our most talented players. Have you seen him in practice?

I have and he's got the goods but...

I am sure he will be needed in the future but would be shocked to say the least if he sees the floor this year - fully capable, just don't need him with Odum, Eitel, Brown and Cummings - GL won't play him ahead of any of those guys.

 

[Southgrad07]

Fair enough but sounds a lot like back pedaling to me.

And to be clear, I would not define 5 points 2 rbs. BIG speaking in terms of impact which is clearly what you were talking about.

But on to more important things.

I expect Bell Cummings, Brown and Burnett all to take a step forward this season. Brown looks to be more physical and ready this season than in years past. He establised himself as a hard on the ball defender last year - I look for him to improve his D all around and likely be a starter along side Odum.

I have a hard time deciding on who should get more mins. between Brown and Cummings - both bring pros and cons to the table. Here is what we know, if Cummings can shoot the ball better and not turn the ball over he will be very impactful. If Brown can play D without fouling, play under control/not turn the ball over and make free throws he will be very impactful. I would expect - based on progression alone that both will improve.

My starting line-up is my under 2 min. Line-up for those that don't like starting line-ups:

PG. JO
SG. Brown
SF. Manny
PF. Smith
C. Gant

That is what I would start, here is what GL will do.

PG. JO
SG. Eitel
SF. Arop
PF. Gant
C. Kitch

Atleast to start the season - you can mix Eitel, Cummings and Brown at any time.

didn't expect to see this from you! haha... As far as preseason expectations for the team I agree mostly with what the OP said. For some odd reason I really think Kitch will have a good year. It does take big guys a bit longer to develop and I liked what I saw from him in the second half of the season when given the chance. I think he will mesh well with Arop, Gant, and Odum on the floor because he doesn't need the ball or shots in order to help the team. Those three will be where the offense is ran through so he should fit in nicely. He gets a lot of his points off dump offs and putbacks.

I admit I haven't seen any of the newcomers play yet at practice but mark it down either Bell or Moore will be playing at least 15 minutes a night. They both have good size and are athletic. Those are commodities that are needed in our front court. Couldn't begin to tell you who will play the minutes but I'd guess Moore at this point. Scott and Etherington are going to have a tough climb to playing time this season but if Cummings or Brown cant handle the load I wouldn't be surprised to see Scott get some solid PT later in the year (providing he doesn't redshirt)


PG- Odum (Expect nothing but the best from him this season, if he stays healthy the battle for POY in the valley should be exciting)
SG- Brown (Hopefully he holds on to the position this season. Need to see an improved jumper and smarter approach on offense to do so)
SF- Arop ( there is not 3 players in this league more talented, but the big question is can put it all together for a full year? )
PF- Gant ( big jump up in consistency from him. Not 18 and 8 a night due to talent around him but needs to be a force on both ends we can count on.)
C- Kitch ( mentioned above. Think he is our best fit with the other four starters. Could see us going small ball with K.Smith if he doesn't work out here)


Bench

K.Smith (with Arop in front not going to put up huge numbers but needs to bring more consistency on a nightly basis. Hopefully the J is better too)
Cummings (I do expect him to shoot it better this season. Has to right? Decision making is the biggest issue for me with him. Has the talent to start tho)
Eitel (Always been a huge fan of having a guy like this in your rotation but not as a starter. Limited player but if he knocks down 3's he has important role)
Moore/Bell ( mentioned above)
Burnett ( I hope he has improved his defense. Wont play much this season with our depth unless that changes. Most yrs. he would be a rotation guy 4sure)
Scott/AE ( mentioned above, redshirting maybe? )

 

[sycamorebacker]

SF- Arop ( there is not 3 players in this league more talented, but the big question is can put it all together for a full year? )

I know Arop is good, but I think he is limited. The thing that bothers me about him is he scores on 3's and jumpers over people; but it seems like he doesn't get enough "easy" points.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

I know Arop is good, but I think he is limited. The thing that bothers me about him is he scores on 3's and jumpers over people; but it seems like he doesn't get enough "easy" points.

But that is his game Backer, that is what he does - he can beat you in many ways off the jump shot, he can pull up, he can spot up and he can fade away. He is a very effective jump shooter inside the 3 pt line, especially when going to the hoop - he uses his off arm well to
create space. When he doesn't settle for the 3 ball and has action toward the hoop he is nasty good!

And lets the record show I have wiped the slate clean for D. Brown, but I've been more than right about his game for a long time - he is a plus defender that makes mistakes away from the ball and he was a horrible ball handler and decision maker last season, did not handle it well at all. But the slate is clean, he is too fast and physical to hurt us like he did last year.

 

[Southgrad07]

His talent was good enough to torch ole miss for about 30. Also huge games against New Mexico and @WSU. When he is right he is a load to stop on offense not to mention he can rebound and defend. Just way to0 sporadic last season