Cardinals Wainwright likely out for 2011 season

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SycamoreBlue3209 said:
This is terrible news for my Redbirds, like Mozeliak said, we just have to plan for the worst and hope for the best.
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Yes, I feel your pain. I was hoping for a ring this season but those hopes just went down the drain. Going 5 years without a ring for us Cardinals fans is like a lifetime.
 
jlandrus23 said:
Yes, I feel your pain. I was hoping for a ring this season but those hopes just went down the drain. Going 5 years without a ring for us Cardinals fans is like a lifetime.
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Never knew the deadbird won that many world seris championships , hmmmm every 5 years at least hhhmmmmmmmmmm
 
jlandrus23 said:
Yes, I feel your pain. I was hoping for a ring this season but those hopes just went down the drain. Going 5 years without a ring for us Cardinals fans is like a lifetime.
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2006, 1982, 1967, 1946, 1944, etc.

GET REAL LANDRUS! GEEZ!!!! :krazy:
 

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We have won 10 world championshps but this is a major hit to wat was realistically a contender with the addition of Berkman.
 
Losing an ace suuuuuuucks. Losing one of the best three pitchers in baseball REALLY sucks.

No one will be able replace him...I just hope the Cards can get the best out of what they have in house, because I just don't see them signing anyone based on what they are saying.
 
Best three pitchers in baseball? Are you kidding me? That was a joke right? Don't get me wrong, he's good. But just off the top of my head...halladay, lincecum, haren, santana, sabathia, greinke, felix hernandez, cliff lee... ALL better than wainwright


Jon said:
Losing an ace suuuuuuucks. Losing one of the best three pitchers in baseball REALLY sucks.

No one will be able replace him...I just hope the Cards can get the best out of what they have in house, because I just don't see them signing anyone based on what they are saying.
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HA yeah there is NO WAY he is top three..NO WAY. He's good but I wouldn't even put him in the top 5. Regardless that sucks for the Cards
 
You guys obviously don't watch much baseball. He is no doubt, whether you want to put him in the top three or five, one of the best pitchers in the game of baseball. I mean come on Haren and Greinke over Wainwright?? Not to say that you mention Lee because of the past few playoffs. Also, did you see Santana last season and that he won't even be pitching this season until June or so?? Look at all the rankings guys.... Jon hit the nail on the head... Wainwright is number three in almost all rankings. BTW he was the SECOND ranked pitcher in all of baseball last season. So the question is....Were YOU guys kidding or joking?? I mean what can you not interpret.. the FACT that he was ranked second at the end of last season and third to start this season? It would be awfully hard to defend your comments considering both of those rankings are in the TOP THREE!! Good luck in your recovery Adam! (:
 
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DaleFor said:
Best three pitchers in baseball? Are you kidding me? That was a joke right? Don't get me wrong, he's good. But just off the top of my head...halladay, lincecum, haren, santana, sabathia, greinke, felix hernandez, cliff lee... ALL better than wainwright
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You should go look the stats up before you make that kind of comment.
Or at least WATCH some baseball.
Since 2007, Wainright has been in the top of the league in Wins, ERA and cy young voting.

He is absolutely one of the top 5 pitchers in baseball.
Period.

"Since the All-Star break in 2007, the midpoint of Wainwright's first season as a big-league starter, no pitcher with more than 100 starts has a better ERA than his 2.68. That bests Halladay, Hernandez and two-time Cy Young winner Tim Lincecum. "

and further:
He and Cy Young Award winner Halladay were the only NL starters to finish in the top 10 in the significant pitching stats such as ERA, innings pitched, strikeouts and WHIP (walks and hits per innings). In a statistical quirk, Wainwright essentially turned opposing batters into him: He held opponents to a .224 average; he's a .223 career hitter.
 
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I can see top five a lot more than i can see TOP THREE.. he's a hell of a pitcher, I just read "top three" and there's no way. Top five, I can see that.


Eleven said:
You should go look the stats up before you make that kind of comment.
Or at least WATCH some baseball.
Since 2007, Wainright has been in the top of the league in Wins, ERA and cy young voting.

He is absolutely one of the top 5 pitchers in baseball.
Period.

"Since the All-Star break in 2007, the midpoint of Wainwright's first season as a big-league starter, no pitcher with more than 100 starts has a better ERA than his 2.68. That bests Halladay, Hernandez and two-time Cy Young winner Tim Lincecum. "

and further:
He and Cy Young Award winner Halladay were the only NL starters to finish in the top 10 in the significant pitching stats such as ERA, innings pitched, strikeouts and WHIP (walks and hits per innings). In a statistical quirk, Wainwright essentially turned opposing batters into him: He held opponents to a .224 average; he's a .223 career hitter.
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How good is Wainwright?

From an NL and MLB standpoint, how good is Wainwright? Since May 22 of
2007, Wainwright has the best ERA of any MLB starting pitcher, 2.74. That's
right; better than Roy Halladay, Tim Lincecum, any of them. Over the last
two seasons, Wainwright ranks No. 1 in the National League in wins (39),
innings pitched (463.1) and ERA (2.53), is 4th in winning percentage, and is
5th in opponents' OPS.

But yeah... we must be kidding.
 
DaleFor said:
I can see top five a lot more than i can see TOP THREE.. he's a hell of a pitcher, I just read "top three" and there's no way. Top five, I can see that.
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It's not THAT much of stretch for top 3.
Name your top 3 and go compare the stats to Waino's.
I GUARANTEE YOU that you will be surprised... just based on your knee-jerk reaction to the post in the first place.

WAY underrated... can you say ODUM? ;-)
 
DaleFor said:
I can see top five a lot more than i can see TOP THREE.. he's a hell of a pitcher, I just read "top three" and there's no way. Top five, I can see that.
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Come on man, I mean you stated that Dan Haren was better than Wainwright. The rankings and stats show that he is top three. Go Cards!! (:
 

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Wins and innings pitched don't mean anything. Dan Haren had five more innings pitched than Wainright, does that mean he's better? No. WAR (wins above replacement) would be a better stat to use and Wainwright has never been number 1 for that - he was number 4 (not top 3). David Price had one less win than Wainright. Does that mean Price is as good as Wainright? No. He's good, he's not top 3. To me, top three to top five is a big difference just because there are those pitchers like Lincecum and Halladay that you don't say in the same breath as Wainright. I know I'm gonna get eaten up for that, just my opinion. I know he was Cy Young two years ago, but not last year. I'm talking strictly 2010, and now. I threw out those other names at first instinct and may have been thinking of how good they WERE for some of them, but not for most of them.


Eleven said:
How good is Wainwright?

From an NL and MLB standpoint, how good is Wainwright? Since May 22 of
2007, Wainwright has the best ERA of any MLB starting pitcher, 2.74. That's
right; better than Roy Halladay, Tim Lincecum, any of them. Over the last
two seasons, Wainwright ranks No. 1 in the National League in wins (39),
innings pitched (463.1) and ERA (2.53), is 4th in winning percentage, and is
5th in opponents' OPS.

But yeah... we must be kidding.
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DaleFor said:
I know he was Cy Young two years ago, but not last year. I'm talking strictly 2010, and now. I threw out those other names at first instinct and may have been thinking of how good they WERE for some of them, but not for most of them.
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So... have you looked at the numbers for all of those players over the last 2 years?
(because if you did, you SURELY wouldn't have included some of those names that you did... Greinke started 1-8 last year - team was 2-11 in his first 13 starts.)

Wainwright has never won a Cy Young.
2 years ago, he had the best ERA and lost to Lincecum who had the most wins (19 to 20) and most K's.
Last year, he had the most wins (20) and lost to Halladay that had fewer wins, but a slightly better ERA.

He has been in Cy Young contention for the last 4 years...

Tell me your top 3 pitchers since 2007.
 
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DaleFor said:
But just off the top of my head...halladay, lincecum, haren, santana, sabathia, greinke, felix hernandez, cliff lee... ALL better than wainwright
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Ok, I'll start with those..
What time frame do you want to compare? (I prefer 3 year statistical comparisons... it gets rid of all the "flukes".)
 
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