Chic-fil-a apparently did something wrong?

[Sackalot]

http://www.hrc.org/blog/entry/chick-fil-a-respondsand-muddies-the-waters-more

I saw this posted on facebook and thought I should share it.

Now, most of you know that I am pretty conservative. And those that know me well know that though I am conservative, I have many friends that are gay and I am supportive of them. But, someone please tell me why in the world, it is an issue within for the "HUMAN RIGHTS CAMPAIGN" that Chic-fil-a, a company that makes no quams whatsoever that they are a Christian based company that closes on Sunday and other indicators throughout their stores has their COO and son of the founder shares that he is against gay marriage and that the company doesn't necessarily agree with it either. Why is that anything for the Human Rights Campaign to be concerned about...shouldn't they be more concerned with, you know, actual human rights...stopping Genocide, stopping sex trafficing, etc. Not concerned that a privately held company with 1600 stores gives $2 million a year to a Christian Organization? Help me with this because I want to understand this concept...the owner of a company makes a statement of his beliefs and his companies beliefs and he is violating human rights?

Isn't this America where there is freedom of speech. Isn't this America where people are free to think, believe, support whatever they want to...provided it isn't illegal? Isn't this the country where people no matter their race, religion, sexual orientation are supposedly tolerant of each other? Am I wrong for seeing the hypocrisy in the idea, that the Human Rights Campaign is demanding tolerance from the COO of Chic-fil-a for something that they feel is a basic human right (?) yet they are not being tolerant of that same COO's right to speak freely of his personal beliefs....

Maybe I am just not getting it. I just can't wrap my head around the idea that marriage is a basic human right like food, water, clothing and shelter. Maybe one of you can help me understand what is wrong...because I see this as down right silly! All I know is that Chic-fil-a is good and I love their chicken sandwich and their chicken fingers and their waffle fries and that they have good Christian values and close on Sundays so their employees can be with their families and their faith on Sundays.

 

[Hammer and Sycamore]

The Human Rights Campaign is an LGBT advocacy group, which is why it says "Working for Lesbian, Gay,
Bisexual and Transgender Equal Rights" at the top of their website. It's not a non-governmental organization like Amnesty International, so "stopping Genocide, stopping sex trafficing, etc" are outside of the framework of what the HRC does. There are plenty of organizations that have that focus, though: Amnesty Int'l, Human Rights Watch, Red Cross, WHO, the ICC, various UN programs, etc. Learning things like this before posting about them is called "basic research."

The Human Rights Campaign is in no way violating the Cathys' freedom of speech, unless you think that disagreeing with someone violates their freedom of speech. It's also incredibly naive to think that people in this country are tolerant of each other "no matter their race, religion, sexual orientation" and to add to that list, gender identity, creed, etc.

Literally nothing in what you linked to is "demanding tolerance from the COO ... yet they are not being tolerant of that same COO's right to speak freely of his personal beliefs." They point out what the COO said and how it's anti-LGBT, and ask readers if that's the kind of company they want to patronize. Obviously you do, but I don't.

But oh no, someone disagrees with my heterosexual Christian worldview! Engage the persecution complex, full throttle!

 

[SycamoreTree]

I will not support anyone or any company that discriminates any group of people based on sexual orintation, I would be embarrassed to admit that you support that.

 

[The Fungo]

I will not support anyone or any company that discriminates any group of people based on sexual orintation, I would be embarrassed to admit that you support that.

I would venture to say that if you never set foot in a Chic-Fil-A, that would not break Truett Cathy's heart. I once heard a story that some economist told Truett how much money he could make if he opened on sundays and his reply was he didn't care how much he could make. He wasn't going to compromise his beliefs of honoring the sabbath to make money. I would venture to say he would say the same thing about homosexual marriage. He is not going to compromise his beleifs to appease to the masses, even if it costs him money. Also, why should a christian be embarrassed to admit that they are against homosexual marriage?

 

[sycamore tuff]

I will not support anyone or any company that discriminates any group of people based on sexual orintation, I would be embarrassed to admit that you support that.

Is there discrimination going on? I support whatever I like to support and don't support the things I do not want to support, with the exception of those things the government is involved with. I have no choice in those matters except with the ballot that I cast. Refusing to sell food to a person based upon race, etc. would be discrimination. Is that what is going on? I don't know of any such matter.

 

[Sackalot]

The Human Rights Campaign is an LGBT advocacy group, which is why it says "Working for Lesbian, Gay,
Bisexual and Transgender Equal Rights" at the top of their website. It's not a non-governmental organization like Amnesty International, so "stopping Genocide, stopping sex trafficing, etc" are outside of the framework of what the HRC does. There are plenty of organizations that have that focus, though: Amnesty Int'l, Human Rights Watch, Red Cross, WHO, the ICC, various UN programs, etc. Learning things like this before posting about them is called "basic research."

The Human Rights Campaign is in no way violating the Cathys' freedom of speech, unless you think that disagreeing with someone violates their freedom of speech. It's also incredibly naive to think that people in this country are tolerant of each other "no matter their race, religion, sexual orientation" and to add to that list, gender identity, creed, etc.

Literally nothing in what you linked to is "demanding tolerance from the COO ... yet they are not being tolerant of that same COO's right to speak freely of his personal beliefs." They point out what the COO said and how it's anti-LGBT, and ask readers if that's the kind of company they want to patronize. Obviously you do, but I don't.

But oh no, someone disagrees with my heterosexual Christian worldview! Engage the persecution complex, full throttle!

I get all that. I understand what this organization does and stands for. My perplextion is how in is their any discrimination occurring. He is sharing his opinion which is the opinion of A LOT of people. The idea that because someone does not support gay marriage means they "HATE" gays is completely ridiculous. It is not "hate" if someone says that they feel that gay marriage is not something that they support. I just don't get it.

 

[mohoops247]

I would venture to say that if you never set foot in a Chic-Fil-A, that would not break Truett Cathy's heart. I once heard a story that some economist told Truett how much money he could make if he opened on sundays and his reply was he didn't care how much he could make. He wasn't going to compromise his beliefs of honoring the sabbath to make money. I would venture to say he would say the same thing about homosexual marriage. He is not going to compromise his beleifs to appease to the masses, even if it costs him money. Also, why should a christian be embarrassed to admit that they are against homosexual marriage?

+1

 

[Hammer and Sycamore]

I get all that. I understand what this organization does and stands for.

Clearly you don't, otherwise why would you have suggested that they focus on genocide and sex trafficking?

My perplextion is how in is their any discrimination occurring. He is sharing his opinion which is the opinion of A LOT of people. The idea that because someone does not support gay marriage means they "HATE" gays is completely ridiculous. It is not "hate" if someone says that they feel that gay marriage is not something that they support. I just don't get it.

The word "hate" doesn't appear anywhere in the article you linked or any of HRC's other coverage of Chick-fil-A, so you can stop attacking figments of your imagination. Maybe try addressing the actual words used by HRC? And discriminating who is eligible to receive the legal benefits of marriage, which are currently not afforded to gay and lesbian couples, is, uh, the textbook definition of discrimination and advocating for that is discriminatory.

 

[Fiji Bill 72]

I had to stop reding after about five comments. This topic is exactly why it does not belong here. This site should be about Indiana State University and the good of the school. It should not be about politics, religion, etc. It divides us. Thanks to Hammer and Sycamore; that is someone I would like to have a drink with and a conversation. Discrimination is just that. It just creates more hate. Chick-fil-A will serve anyone who walks in the door; I am not sure sure they would hire a gay person though, and that might be discrimination. The CEO has his right to his views. But if he is going to spend his profits by supporting groups that are against LGBT rights, then anyone who believe that everyone in America is equal and every Christian who believes God created us all equal should exercies his/her freedom and just not spend money in that spot. The store owners are upset because they now see the damage done. Straight people of both political parties will just not spend their money there.
Again, let's get politics out of this site.

 

[Hammer and Sycamore]

let's take a look at just how ridiculously you have mischaracterized the HRC's position in this thread:

he is violating human rights?

Isn't this America where there is freedom of speech.

(implying that the HRC is in any way threatening that)

the Human Rights Campaign is demanding tolerance from the COO of Chic-fil-a for something that they feel is a basic human right (?) yet they are not being tolerant of that same COO's right to speak freely of his personal beliefs....

The idea that because someone does not support gay marriage means they "HATE" gays is completely ridiculous.

It is not "hate" if someone says that they feel that gay marriage is not something that they support. I just don't get it.

wow, the HRC must be pretty viciously going after this guy! let's see just how vicious they are:

The company says they respect all of their customers –regardless of sexual orientation – and, moving forward, don’t plan to go near the issue of marriage equality:

Going forward, our intent is to leave the policy debate over same-sex marriage to the government and political arena.

But it’s hard for Chick-fil-A’s statement to jive with what Dan Cathy said last week. In addition to proudly declaring “guilty as charged” when asked about the company’s anti-LGBT giving, Cathy later said: “We’re inviting God’s judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say we know better than You as to what constitutes marriage.”

It certainly sounds like Chick-fil-A’s COO has a very political stance on marriage equality.

how intolerant! how stifling of Cathy's free speech! look at how they call his words "hate"! look how they suggest that Cathy hates gays!!!

oh wait, they don't do any of this. you're just wildly misreading what they're saying and trying to gin up a non-issue about an organization you have no fucking clue about.

 

[sycamore tuff]

I had to stop reding after about five comments. This topic is exactly why it does not belong here. This site should be about Indiana State University and the good of the school. It should not be about politics, religion, etc. It divides us. Thanks to Hammer and Sycamore; that is someone I would like to have a drink with and a conversation. Discrimination is just that. It just creates more hate. Chick-fil-A will serve anyone who walks in the door; I am not sure sure they would hire a gay person though, and that might be discrimination. The CEO has his right to his views. But if he is going to spend his profits by supporting groups that are against LGBT rights, then anyone who believe that everyone in America is equal and every Christian who believes God created us all equal should exercies his/her freedom and just not spend money in that spot. The store owners are upset because they now see the damage done. Straight people of both political parties will just not spend their money there.
Again, let's get politics out of this site.

Can I order this stuff on line? We need to get one of these places in terre haute. Look people, it's his company. He should have the right to do what he wants. It is his right to give his opinion about something. It is the right of anyone to boycot his business if they wish. I have eaten there and was less than thrilled by the food. However, the next time I drive by one I will stop in and give them my money.

 

[Bluesier]

I had to stop reding after about five comments. This topic is exactly why it does not belong here. This site should be about Indiana State University and the good of the school. It should not be about politics, religion, etc. It divides us. Thanks to Hammer and Sycamore; that is someone I would like to have a drink with and a conversation. Discrimination is just that. It just creates more hate. Chick-fil-A will serve anyone who walks in the door; I am not sure sure they would hire a gay person though, and that might be discrimination. The CEO has his right to his views. But if he is going to spend his profits by supporting groups that are against LGBT rights, then anyone who believe that everyone in America is equal and every Christian who believes God created us all equal should exercies his/her freedom and just not spend money in that spot. The store owners are upset because they now see the damage done. Straight people of both political parties will just not spend their money there.
Again, let's get politics out of this site.

You say this, yet, you agree with Hammer's political views.

 

[SycamoreFan317]

The definition of the forum this is posted under:
Ye Olde Sycamore Pub(8 Viewing)
Open-topic moderated forum. Any topic (within reason) is appropriate here as long as they can be discussed with at least a degree of tact, civility, and respect for differing opinions.

Now I am pretty sure that takes in politics and religion. If you don't like the topic then don't read the thread.

 

[Sackalot]

let's take a look at just how ridiculously you have mischaracterized the HRC's position in this thread:



(implying that the HRC is in any way threatening that)







wow, the HRC must be pretty viciously going after this guy! let's see just how vicious they are:



how intolerant! how stifling of Cathy's free speech! look at how they call his words "hate"! look how they suggest that Cathy hates gays!!!

oh wait, they don't do any of this. you're just wildly misreading what they're saying and trying to gin up a non-issue about an organization you have no fucking clue about.

H&S, I full well understand what the HRC is and what it does. And, yes I took liberty to in saying that the HRC was implying that hate speech or "Hate" as I put it was occurring. I was implying that from several other articles that I read on the subject while waiting for my car's oil to be changed. My entire point was lost on you and obviously many others...which is fine. What I am simply saying is that, to me, marriage is not a basic human right. I do not have the right to get married. I have have the right to freedom of speech, I have the right to liberty under the constitution, I have the right to personal safety, etc. What I do not have is the right to drive a car, I have the privilege. That is a ridiculous example, but it helps me to illustrate my point. I do not feel that marriage is a human right, the ability to love anyone..a human right! Without question a human right! The right to live and pursue happiness within the law...absolutely a human right. But I do not have the right to legally drive a car, that is not a basic human right. It is also not a basic human right to "legally" marry any person. My simple stance is that there is a very big difference between human rights and what we may want or ethically think is fair. Many may want same sex marriage to be made legal, but claiming it is a basic human right is tantamount to saying that driving is a basic human right when it is not. If we are to accept the argument that marriage is a basic human right, we must also accept that many, many, many other things are human rights too. We would have to accept that a college education is a human right, that loans from a bank are a human right, etc. Now you will certainly say that I am being ridiculous and those are not the same thing. And I would say, of course they are not the same...except that in terms of legality they are very similar. My point is simple, the HRC tries to make that argument of marriage being a human right and fails because it is not considered a human right by the courts, by the constitution and so on.

Look people can care for, love, live with, hug, kiss, hold, etc. anyone that they want...it is not my place to decide what they can or can't do in their own home with their partner (gay or straight). My only point is that the HRC is making every attempt, along with many other LGBTQ groups to attack this company and subsequently many, many, many Americans simply because they believe something, something that is currently the law in most states. The HRC might not have used the HATE word in giving their side, but many other articles, many Mayors now, and many commentators have used the word HATE to describe the statements of the COO of Chic-fil-a, and I don't see it as HATE. Nothing in Chic-fil-a's business practices suggest any form of discrimination, so the only HATE occurring is against Chic-fil-a, its COO and its employees. It is illogical to make a correlation between one man, stating his personal and religious belief and equating that statement to him vehemently violating discrimination laws through hatred.

I hope that somewhat clears it up. Simply, marriage is not a human right to me (as a Married Man) and the HRC is trying to make that argument. I don't agree, and that does not mean I am a bigot, or that I hate anyone, it means I think that there are far more important arguments to be argued and far more fights to be fought with far more importance to our country. The fight that has been occurring over Chic-fil-a is ridiculous and a waste of time...I mean, I just lost 15 minutes of my day trying to explain my stance and now that I have...I just realized how utterly stupid and futile this is.

 

[bluebill]

BOY ! The boycott of Chick-fil-a is not working out as planned. I like Chikin' !

 

[bent20]

I support Freedom of Choice.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

http://www.owldolatrous.com/?p=288 - Something going around right now.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

I had to stop reding after about five comments. This topic is exactly why it does not belong here. This site should be about Indiana State University and the good of the school. It should not be about politics, religion, etc. It divides us. Thanks to Hammer and Sycamore; that is someone I would like to have a drink with and a conversation. Discrimination is just that. It just creates more hate. Chick-fil-A will serve anyone who walks in the door; I am not sure sure they would hire a gay person though, and that might be discrimination. The CEO has his right to his views. But if he is going to spend his profits by supporting groups that are against LGBT rights, then anyone who believe that everyone in America is equal and every Christian who believes God created us all equal should exercies his/her freedom and just not spend money in that spot. The store owners are upset because they now see the damage done. Straight people of both political parties will just not spend their money there.
Again, let's get politics out of this site.

You can pretty much tell what threads are going to be political by the title. I usually avoid said threads. That's the best advice I can give.

 

[Hammer and Sycamore]

http://www.owldolatrous.com/?p=288 - Something going around right now.

This is a very well-spoken explanation of everything that is wrong with Chick-fil-A and its supporters. Thanks for sharing; I'll pass this along.

 

[SycamoreFan317]

This is a very well-spoken explanation of everything that is wrong with Chick-fil-A and its supporters. Thanks for sharing; I'll pass this along.

It is wrong in your opinion only.