Indiana State takes lead on Million Women Mentors initiative

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Jason Svoboda

The Bird Level
Administrator
Female faculty, staff and alumni at Indiana State University are taking te lead in helping recruit 5,000 women mntors across the state to encourge girls and women to pursue science, math, engineering and technology careers.

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Here we go. Speaking strictly in generalities, women do not like science and math as much as men. There's nothing wrong with recruiting, but please let the little girls do what they want and convince them to pursue careers that are in demand. If you find a woman that likes math and science, that's great. But don't try to put a round peg in a square hole just because she wears a skirt.

I hope somebody is recruiting young men with a math aptitude to get into science and math.
 
Here we go. Speaking strictly in generalities, women do not like science and math as much as men. There's nothing wrong with recruiting, but please let the little girls do what they want and convince them to pursue careers that are in demand. If you find a woman that likes math and science, that's great. But don't try to put a round peg in a square hole just because she wears a skirt.

I hope somebody is recruiting young men with a math aptitude to get into science and math.

With all due respect, if you're suggesting there is an a priori predisposition from the female gender against becoming scientific professionals, you're just dead wrong. I challenge you to support your opinion with some scientific research in this area.

Signed, husband of an outstanding family physician, father of a daughter, who is an outstanding scientific medical policy scholar,Retired HR executive who recruited engineers for more than 40 years.

We applaud ISU's initiatives in this area.
 
With all due respect, if you're suggesting there is an a priori predisposition from the female gender against becoming scientific professionals, you're just dead wrong. I challenge you to support your opinion with some scientific research in this area.

Signed, husband of an outstanding family physician, father of a daughter, who is an outstanding scientific medical policy scholar,Retired HR executive who recruited engineers for more than 40 years.

We applaud ISU's initiatives in this area.

Wow. This is the easiest thing I have EVER had to prove. If you don't know men are more interested in engineering than women, I don't know where you have been. If you check SAT scores for math, the higher scores are very heavily male and the lower scores are very heavily female.
In 2013, 19% of engineering graduates were women.

I've worked with many women that had excellent math skills and could have done ANYTHING they wanted to do. I never heard any of them say they wished they were an engineer. Most of them, if you mention some law of Physics, they are like - Who cares.

With all due respect to your wife, no pride member has a smarter wife than I do, and she couldn't give a diddly-darn about science or math. The only arithmetic she does is to figure percent off on sales.

https://secure-media.collegeboard.o...sat/sat-percentile-ranks-mathematics-2014.pdf
 
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Wow. This is the easiest thing I have EVER had to prove. If you don't know men are more interested in engineering than women, I don't know where you have been. If you check SAT scores for math, the higher scores are very heavily male and the lower scores are very heavily female.
In 2013, 19% of engineering graduates were women.

I've worked with many women that had excellent math skills and could have done ANYTHING they wanted to do. I never heard any of them say they wished they were an engineer. Most of them, if you mention some law of Physics, they are like - Who cares.

With all due respect to your wife, no pride member has a smarter wife than I do, and she couldn't give a diddly-darn about science or math. The only arithmetic she does is to figure percent off on sales.

https://secure-media.collegeboard.o...sat/sat-percentile-ranks-mathematics-2014.pdf

SB
I'm hoping you misunderstood me. I'll clarify: Is there a 'Numeracy Gender Gap' ? Absolutely. Has it been narrowing over the last 40 years? Slightly in the United States and dramatically in several other developed countries. Is the 'Numeracy Gender Gap' in any way related to biological/genetic reasons (which I thought you were claiming)? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!

NGG is exclusively related to social and cultural factors and the expectations and confidence levels that result. Again, I applaud ISU for taking the steps they are, which I believe in some small but substantive way,will expedite the closing and elimination of this gap.

By the way, my wife and I are also pretty good with sales percentage math. Maybe the 3 of us can help bring you up the learning curve in this undervalued mathematical skill set.
 
SB
I'm hoping you misunderstood me. I'll clarify: Is there a 'Numeracy Gender Gap' ? Absolutely. Has it been narrowing over the last 40 years? Slightly in the United States and dramatically in several other developed countries. Is the 'Numeracy Gender Gap' in any way related to biological/genetic reasons (which I thought you were claiming)? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!

NGG is exclusively related to social and cultural factors and the expectations and confidence levels that result. Again, I applaud ISU for taking the steps they are, which I believe in some small but substantive way,will expedite the closing and elimination of this gap.

By the way, my wife and I are also pretty good with sales percentage math. Maybe the 3 of us can help bring you up the learning curve in this undervalued mathematical skill set.

Not sure how to describe differences in aptitude or interest. Don't know if it's called biological or genetic. But there is a huge difference between boys and girls. I have 3 daughters and 3 grandsons and they are totally different. Boys like wheels and bugs and girls don't. A lot more boys want to be engineers than girls. Any effort to lead girls into engineering is misguided and a waste of money. If they want to take math and science, they will without being lead by the nose.

We should be trying to get ALL kids into engineering and other professions that are in demand.

Cultural and social factors? Man, that is funny. They are different as soon as they slide down the chute.

http://www.mastersofhealthcare.com/blog/2009/10-big-differences-between-mens-and-womens-brains/

and quote:Spatial Skills

One reason boys consistently outscore girls on the math portion of the SAT is that they have a leg up on spatial skills — or the ability to solve problems involving size, distance, and the relationship between objects. Although social expectations for male mathletes probably play a big role in this gender difference — as does a bigger love for video games and sports — the rift does appear very early in life. Studies suggest that boys as young as three to five months old can visualize how an object will appear when rotated, while girls of the same age can’t.
 
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Not sure how to describe differences in aptitude or interest. Don't know if it's called biological or genetic. But there is a huge difference between boys and girls. I have 3 daughters and 3 grandsons and they are totally different. Boys like wheels and bugs and girls don't. A lot more boys want to be engineers than girls. Any effort to lead girls into engineering is misguided and a waste of money. If they want to take math and science, they will without being lead by the nose.

We should be trying to get ALL kids into engineering and other professions that are in demand.

Cultural and social factors? Man, that is funny. They are different as soon as they slide down the chute.

http://www.mastersofhealthcare.com/blog/2009/10-big-differences-between-mens-and-womens-brains/

and quote:Spatial Skills

One reason boys consistently outscore girls on the math portion of the SAT is that they have a leg up on spatial skills — or the ability to solve problems involving size, distance, and the relationship between objects. Although social expectations for male mathletes probably play a big role in this gender difference — as does a bigger love for video games and sports — the rift does appear very early in life. Studies suggest that boys as young as three to five months old can visualize how an object will appear when rotated, while girls of the same age can’t.

SB - I now discover I did not misunderstand you and that you populate a world of a priori thinkers who are absolutely convinced there is some kind of divine plan, which has legislated what men and women can and cannot be and can and cannot do. What amazes me are that these beliefs continue to be adamantly adhered to, despite the statistical reality that all these gender gaps are being narrowed and gender stereotypes are being challenged. More female engineers worldwide than ever before; more female soldiers; more male nurses; more stay-at-home dads; more female attorneys, M D's, governors, senators, prime ministers, CEOs, cabinet members, board members of Fortune 500 companies and, as the King of Siam said in the King and I,"Etcetera, Etcetera,Etcetera".
What do you think is happening? Are your theories, which you seem to be purporting as scientific and/or divine law, being proven to be invalid or are all these women who have narrowed the gender gaps really men who have cleverly camouflaged their penises? You know, you and I, given our ages, probably won't be in a strong position to say, " I told you so" about our instant disagreement until we have passed on. There just won't be enough definitive data. So suffice it to say, I agreed to respectfully continue to disagree with you. It is my belief, the Numeracity gender gap will disappear and go to the same graveyard of gender, race, and ethnically biased stereotypes which inters the likes of " Women aren't equipped to vote" and "Blacks aren't equipped to be free".
 
SB - I now discover I did not misunderstand you and that you populate a world of a priori thinkers who are absolutely convinced there is some kind of divine plan, which has legislated what men and women can and cannot be and can and cannot do. What amazes me are that these beliefs continue to be adamantly adhered to, despite the statistical reality that all these gender gaps are being narrowed and gender stereotypes are being challenged. More female engineers worldwide than ever before; more female soldiers; more male nurses; more stay-at-home dads; more female attorneys, M D's, governors, senators, prime ministers, CEOs, cabinet members, board members of Fortune 500 companies and, as the King of Siam said in the King and I,"Etcetera, Etcetera,Etcetera".
What do you think is happening? Are your theories, which you seem to be purporting as scientific and/or divine law, being proven to be invalid or are all these women who have narrowed the gender gaps really men who have cleverly camouflaged their penises? You know, you and I, given our ages, probably won't be in a strong position to say, " I told you so" about our instant disagreement until we have passed on. There just won't be enough definitive data. So suffice it to say, I agreed to respectfully continue to disagree with you. It is my belief, the Numeracity gender gap will disappear and go to the same graveyard of gender, race, and ethnically biased stereotypes which inters the likes of " Women aren't equipped to vote" and "Blacks aren't equipped to be free".

Well, you feel very strongly about this and I respect that.

The problem is you are a liberal and a wart on our country. Liberals think they know what OTHERS should do and want to make their decisions for them. We conservatives are about freedom and personal responsibility. You think girls would be BETTER people if they were engineers and you don't trust them to make their own decisions. I guess you don't think they are smart enough to know what they want to do without your HELP.
 
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Well, you feel very strongly about this and I respect that.

The problem is you are a liberal and a wart on our country. Liberals think they know what OTHERS should do and want to make their decisions for them. We conservatives are about freedom and personal responsibility. You think girls would be BETTER people if they were engineers and you don't trust them to make their own decisions. I guess you don't think they are smart enough to know what they want to do without your HELP.

1st things 1st: Read your response ,above when you originally posted with just the 1st sentence alone (where, in my opinion, you should have left it). That evening I hit this thread again and, disappointed, saw you had edited it with the preachy, self-righteous name-calling. My guess is the lesser half of your personality kicked in. Sort of like with Dr. Jekyll when Mr. Hyde would show up.

I want to remind you of the inception and crux of our disagreement. Our good friend, Jason, posted an ISU press release about an academic/political initiative by female faculty, staff and alumni from ISU supporting the million woman mentor initiative. I thoroughly read the article Jason posted and saw the mentorship program was actually a national and state initiative. I also surmised ISU's support for it and roll in it seemed reasonable, and did a little Google research on what was happening nationally and in the State of Indiana. What did I discover? Wherever I researched there was support for the initiative!! Miraculously, there was bipartisan political and gender support. As, no doubt you know, the State of Indiana's point person is the female lieutenant governor from Ferdinand, Sue Ellspermann. Many Republican insiders are suggesting she's a rising star in the party with impeccable credentials, including but not limited to, her undergraduate industrial engineering degree from Purdue and her industrial engineering PhD from the University of Louisville. Once, having done the research, I read your initial post and quickly reviewed your profile. I could not help but think, "Why, as a retired alum, is this guy busting on his alma mater and throwing it under the bus with a reactionary diatribe against something as meritorious and broadly supported as this initiative?" I still do not know the answer to this puzzling question. "Is this truly a Sycamore Backer with Sycamore Pride?" I asked myself.

Now my reaction to your self-righteous name-calling: You don't know me well enough to stereotype me, and certainly do not have the right to suggest I'm a blemish on my country, a blemish that normally is surgically removed as a disfigurement (a number of connotations can be taken here in your purported sarcastic humor which, I hope now, you realize crossed the line and merits an apology). For clarification here is some further information: I am as good an American as you think you are, and a better American than you actually are. The reason, because I make judgments on a case-by-case basis, while your MO appears to be one of making judgments as prophetic pronouncements based on your worldview. Your world appears to be one of absolutes. Your world, also, appears to see social and cultural change as things to be feared and stopped instead of analyzed/evaluated and, when merited, sometimes embraced. Well, SB, you and I will have a myriad of opportunities to test our approaches to social and cultural change over our remaining couple decades on this earth, because , like it or not, a tsunami of social and cultural change is at our doorstep. No longer the 7th century, SB, the 21st.

Oh by the way, trust me, I no more deserve to be categorized as a liberal as you deserve to be categorized as a conservative (my perception is that you're somewhere right of conservatism on the political continuum). My above conclusion on your categorization of me as a liberal is in recognition of my public political perception: This may surprise you, but I get equally criticized by my liberal friends for not agreeing with some of their positions because I'm "SOO conservative" as I am by my conservative friends for not agreeing with some of their positions because I'm "SOO liberal". As a result, I see myself as a centrist, factoring in proportionate amounts of self and public perception. Some food for thought for your there, SB.

So what are the options here? 1. We can call it quits with cordial adieus and acknowledgments we agreed to disagree (which I thought I had accomplished in my last post). 2. We can continue our intellectual fencing, absent the name-calling, and see where that takes us (If we do this, we could probably go on an infomercial together selling our intellectual "blog fencing" as a way to postpone the onset of Alzheimer's and other forms of dementia). 3. We can invite other S P members to voice their opinion. Though all 3 have their merits, I again vote for # 1. Your call.
 
Well, let's all put our arms around each other and sing a nice, soothing rendition of Kumbaya... :tumbleweeds:
 
Well, let's all put our arms around each other and sing a nice, soothing rendition of Kumbaya... :tumbleweeds:

Isn't that the good thing about this country, as opposed to Muslim or Communist countries. We can all live together and co-exist.

I would just rather any money spent on twisting girls' arms to be engineers would be spent on homes for pregnant teenagers. Our daughter got pregnant while a Sr in HS. It was ok for her, but I have heard of some parents kicking their daughters out; and where can they go?
 
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