Winning seasons

[bent20]

Sharing this in the pub because it's not really specific to one team. Over the next couple of weeks it will be interesting to watch how our softball and baseball teams do. Why?

Our baseball team hasn't had a losing season since 2008. That's a big deal around these parts. They're 19-16 right now.

Softball (presently 29-29) has the chance to be the only W-L team outside of baseball to have a winning record since volleyball did it in 2015.

Here are the last above .500 seasons by ISU team:

Volleyball: 2015
Softball: 2014
Soccer: Never? Did we have soccer prior to 2000 (that's as far back as gosycamores goes?) If not, never.
Women’s basketball: 2014
Men’s basketball: 2013
Football: 2014
Baseball: 2017 (Last losing season was 2008)

Note: Swimming and diving did have a winning season last year, but only their second season.

 

[TreeTop]

Thank you for these depressing facts.

 

[bent20]

Yes, it is depressing, but something we should probably all be aware of. It's not just football and basketball that have been consistently under performing.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

Yes, it is depressing, but something we should probably all be aware of. It's not just football and basketball that have been consistently under performing.

Are you going somewhere with this?

If hoops has peanuts to work with, what do you think a volleyball coach has? Some of our programs in the past haven't even had a full compliment of scholarships to work with. So if you're splitting scholarships instead of giving full rides, you're likely not going to get the better players. For example, baseball has 11.7 scholarships and must be dividing among the 25 man team. Now imagine not even getting the 11.7 to fill out your roster.

I believe only hoops, gymnastics, tennis and volleyball are "head count" sports where you cannot split them up.

 

[WOZ]

Are you going somewhere with this?

I hoops has peanuts to work with, what do you think a volleyball coach has? Some of our programs in the past haven't even had a full compliment of scholarships to work with. So if you're splitting scholarships instead of giving full rides, you're likely not going to get the better players. For example, baseball has 11.7 scholarships and must be dividing among the 25 man team. Now imagine not even getting the 11.7 to fill out your roster
I believe only hoops, gymnastics, tennis and volleyball are "head count" sports where you cannot split them up.

How many do we give out for baseball?

 

[4Q_iu]

Are you going somewhere with this?

I hoops has peanuts to work with, what do you think a volleyball coach has? Some of our programs in the past haven't even had a full compliment of scholarships to work with. So if you're splitting scholarships instead of giving full rides, you're likely not going to get the better players. For example, baseball has 11.7 scholarships and must be dividing among the 25 man team. Now imagine not even getting the 11.7 to fill out your roster.

I believe only hoops, gymnastics, tennis and volleyball are "head count" sports where you cannot split them up.

do they now allow Div I football scholies to be split? that's a change, no?

 

[bent20]

Are you going somewhere with this?

I hoops has peanuts to work with, what do you think a volleyball coach has? Some of our programs in the past haven't even had a full compliment of scholarships to work with. So if you're splitting scholarships instead of giving full rides, you're likely not going to get the better players. For example, baseball has 11.7 scholarships and must be dividing among the 25 man team. Now imagine not even getting the 11.7 to fill out your roster.

I believe only hoops, gymnastics, tennis and volleyball are "head count" sports where you cannot split them up.

Looking at it from a potentially positive perspective, we desperately need the momentum overall to shift. Baseball and softball are just verily clinging to finishing above .500. Not being above .500 in any sport would be pretty bad (and obviously it's already pretty bad).

If the problem is we can't compete in the MVC in any sport (save for cross country and track and field), then let's get out of the MVC!

 

[Hooper]

Looking at it from a potentially positive perspective, we desperately need the momentum overall to shift. Baseball and softball are just verily clinging to finishing above .500. Not being above .500 in any sport would be pretty bad (and obviously it's already pretty bad).

If the problem is we can't compete in the MVC in any sport (save for cross country and track and field), then let's get out of the MVC!

We can be and have been competitive in the MVC. If you want to see bad look at what the last 12 months have been like at Evansville. They’re at or near the bottom of the league in almost every sport.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

do they now allow Div I football scholies to be split? that's a change, no?

At FCS, they can be split. You also don't have to full fund the 63 and we didn't for a long time. At FBS level, they are full head count I believe and you are allowed under the 85 but it is something like you can't do it back-to-back years I believe. Someone would have to correct me on that.

 

[bent20]

We can be and have been competitive in the MVC. If you want to see bad look at what the last 12 months have been like at Evansville. They’re at or near the bottom of the league in almost every sport.

Their men's basketball and men's soccer teams just completed winning seasons if you look at overall records. We finished one game above them in conference W-L in men's basketball, so let's not act all high and mighty just because we swept the series. Again, baseball is the only sport at ISU that has had a winning season since 2015. So overall we're worse! If you want to see bad, look at us! I guess if I had a point with this post, maybe that's it. Let's stop living in denial because we're one game better here and there. If we're not the worst MVC school, we're very much in the running. Forget Evansville, we're at or near the bottom of the league in almost every sport. Sorry if that bursts your school pride, but where is the indignation with losing so much? It's just reluctant acceptance and "Well, at least we're not THAT bad" arguments.

If we can't compete financially, let's not just keep doing what we're doing and hoping for an occasional surprise season where we creep above .500. If we lack the money, let's not pretend it's going to magically appear from out of no where, or wait and hope everyone else comes back to us.

 

[BrokerZ]

Looking at straight win/loss records with zero context is like comparing two baseball players and blindly saying the one with the higher batting average is the better player.

You’re much better off looking st MVC-only win/loss records. At least in that exercise you’d be comparing records against similar opponents. For example, yes, Evansville basketball had a winning record this year. They played an absolute dogshit schedule. We actually sacked-up and played some good teams. Saying Evansville we good only because they were .500 or better, and saying we weren’t because we finished below .500, is a strawman argument at best.

 

[bent20]

Looking at straight win/loss records with zero context is like comparing two baseball players and blindly saying the one with the higher batting average is the better player.

You’re much better off looking st MVC-only win/loss records. At least in that exercise you’d be comparing records against similar opponents. For example, yes, Evansville basketball had a winning record this year. They played an absolute dogshit schedule. We actually sacked-up and played some good teams. Saying Evansville we good only because they were .500 or better, and saying we weren’t because we finished below .500, is a strawman argument at best.

Evansville was 25-9 in 2015, just three years ago. 12-6 in conference. We haven't won more than 20 games and 12 conference games since 2013.

But if we're only worried about being slightly better than Evansville in men's basketball this past season (since this is where this conversation has drifted), I guess my point is lost on you guys. All I was trying to point out is things have been really ugly, we have a chance to turn them around in the coming weeks, but we need to recognize we're not competitive in several sports, including the ones most people don't pay attention to.

 

[niklz62]

At FCS, they can be split. You also don't have to full fund the 63 and we didn't for a long time. At FBS level, they are full head count I believe and you are allowed under the 85 but it is something like you can't do it back-to-back years I believe. Someone would have to correct me on that.

I think FBS can have 85 players on full scholarships and FCS can split 63 scholarships between 85 players but the dont have to. I was surprised to hear that one FCS school didnt do partial scholarships but I cant remember what school it was. It was a upper level program but who it was is escaping me.

 

[OX 92]

In fairness to softball. The turn around is actually very impressive. The fact they can end with a winning season is very positive. They have been competitive with all MVC teams with Drake as an exception. As of today they are 3rd in the MVC. They finished last in 2017. Coach Pooch is going to build a winner. He is very respected in the softball community. A new scoreboard would be nice

 

[IndyTreeFan]

I think that Clinkscales will build the department into a winner. His coaching hires have been seemingly good thus far. The big one, football, MUST take a step (or three) forward this year. But the coaches he has brought in seem to have injected life into moribund programs. As we saw with Trent Miles, though, it's one thing to build a program from scratch, another to take it to the championship level and sustain it...