IHSAA Basketball on the decline

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In most ways, the Class 4A schools in Indiana are similar to the the Power 5 FB schools. The membership constitutes 25% of the total membership (of D1) and wants to hog all of the money. The P5 schools have gained ever increasing autonomy because they generate most of the revenue and threaten to go start their own division inside or outside of the NCAA.

That option is not viable for the 4A schools in Indiana. Most were severely hurt when the revenue streams of the state tournament, which were hoarded by the big schools using enrollment based distributions, dried up after the division into classes. If they broke off, they would face the same issues financially.

To make up for that we have things like the Wabash Valley Classic with 16 teams held in alternating years at THS and THN. These are good ($4,000/school is reported) moneymakers for these schools as attendance is pretty good for the later rounds or early rounds with a good matchup. I am assuming that the 14 smaller schools in the field make enough money to keep them coming back so it works for everyone. But the competitive balance is still a struggle. THN has won the title 11 times including one time when it was 0-6 entering the tournament.

Smaller schools are exceedingly happy with the current Class structure for many reasons: financial, competitive balance, more influence with officials who previously were required to have a power school schedule to referee deep into the state tournament, fan support, reduced transfers of star players to bigger schools. The list could continue with a bit more thought.

Breaking the Power 5 conferences out of the current NCAA Div I might be the best path forward both for them and the balance of the D1. I doubt that would be the case for Indiana HS Sports.
 

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Rocktucky (now Parke Heritage) won the Classic as a 1A school when RJ's little brother played there. They are still 1A even after absorbing a very small Turkey Run and were the Class 1A state runner ups last year.
 
Yea, Vincennes wants in the PAC with other like schools.... regarding the class system... Single class in basketball is the way to go. Small schools can beat the shit out of big schools all day with a good system - I love that type of basketball. Football - it's about numbers and strength and small schools can't compete - need classes. Matter of fact - look at Loogootee and Bar-Reeve... schools like that are consistently better than the best 3A schools in the same region in basketball. Baseball - no class needed, either.
Last year, if I recall, little South Spencer went up to Terre Haute and beat the shit out of one of those schools.
 
Loogootee and Barr- Reeve aren’t beating the beat 3A teams year in and year out. Silver Creek last year, Greensburg with McIntosh, Sellers, and Welaje, Washington with the Zellers? Come on
 
I forgot to mention that the fellow who ran concessions for THN said that over 10 years ago their booster club cleared over $25,000 in profits from hosting the WV Classic; so they are tremendously dependent even today on revenue streams from the rural schools around TH.

This year Clay City hosted its own holiday tournament for the first time and had an interesting field: Fort Wayne North and Martinsville were in the field as 4A schools, Trader's Point Christian, Clay City, Benton Central from 100 miles away and three other small schools I cannot remember off the top of my head. Getting schools from outside of the area to travel to the WV brings in some money and gives both teams a chance to play against teams which they would never see otherwise. From all accounts it was a success with FW North winning the tournament.

I have no idea what motivated this step, but it will be interesting to learn if a new trend starts to emerge with schools going back to 4 or 8 team tourneys over the holidays to get a greater share of the revenue than they can get under the current WV Classic format.
 
I played ball in the one class Indiana tournament system and still YouTube the finals on occasion (want to see a well played game go to the East Chicago vs Evansville Bosse 1962 final game). That being said it is unlikely for Indiana to change back given the political climate. I coached in Colorado when the state had 3 classes 3A for large schools, 2A for towns and medium sized, 1A for small schools. We used Sagarin ratings to seed the District playoffs (same as sectionals) so that every regular season game counted. It was competitive and awesome, not like Indiana used to be, but still really good. Attendance still is good at some spots in Indiana, way way down in others.
 

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DyedBlue said:
I forgot to mention that the fellow who ran concessions for THN said that over 10 years ago their booster club cleared over $25,000 in profits from hosting the WV Classic; so they are tremendously dependent even today on revenue streams from the rural schools around TH.

This year Clay City hosted its own holiday tournament for the first time and had an interesting field: Fort Wayne North and Martinsville were in the field as 4A schools, Trader's Point Christian, Clay City, Benton Central from 100 miles away and three other small schools I cannot remember off the top of my head. Getting schools from outside of the area to travel to the WV brings in some money and gives both teams a chance to play against teams which they would never see otherwise. From all accounts it was a success with FW North winning the tournament.

I have no idea what motivated this step, but it will be interesting to learn if a new trend starts to emerge with schools going back to 4 or 8 team tourneys over the holidays to get a greater share of the revenue than they can get under the current WV Classic format.
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I think Riverton Parke was in the Clay City tournament. They essentially got kicked out of the WV Classic. I think some of the local schools not being invited to the WVC is what drove that tournament.

Personally I think a 32 team field with one side of the bracket at THN and the other side at THS would be pretty cool. There's lot of schools in the WV Valley that would love to participate in it I'd imagine.
 
Sycamorefan96 said:
I think Riverton Parke was in the Clay City tournament. They essentially got kicked out of the WV Classic. I think some of the local schools not being invited to the WVC is what drove that tournament.

Personally I think a 32 team field with one side of the bracket at THN and the other side at THS would be pretty cool. There's lot of schools in the WV Valley that would love to participate in it I'd imagine.
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Screw 32 - Go back and run a tourney like The ORIGINAL Wabash Valley Tourney

"... Between 1936 and 1961, there were more than 100 entries each year. In 1947, 124 teams participated, the all-time high..."

https://indianamemory.contentdm.oclc.org/digital/collection/vchs/id/653
 
Class basketball ruined one of the things Indiana was known for. Today's tourney doesn't draw nearly the numbers that the one class tourney drew. Back in th eightys very small Southridge(Huntingburg and Holland) made it to the final game two years in row. The town was almost deserted the night of the championship game. Both years they lost to mega school Marion but it gave those kids and the towns something to brag about for years.
 
Sycamorefan96 said:
I think Riverton Parke was in the Clay City tournament. They essentially got kicked out of the WV Classic. I think some of the local schools not being invited to the WVC is what drove that tournament.

Personally I think a 32 team field with one side of the bracket at THN and the other side at THS would be pretty cool. There's lot of schools in the WV Valley that would love to participate in it I'd imagine.
Click to expand...
You can’t have more than 16 teams in an in season tournament.
 
4Q_iu said:
Screw 32 - Go back and run a tourney like The ORIGINAL Wabash Valley Tourney

"... Between 1936 and 1961, there were more than 100 entries each year. In 1947, 124 teams participated, the all-time high..."

https://indianamemory.contentdm.oclc.org/digital/collection/vchs/id/653
Click to expand...
LOL..the ol' "keyboard" must not have access to the massive school restructuring/consolidation which occurred during the early 60's, especially in Vigo County:

www.tribstar.com

Consolidation changed Vigo County

Sandy Billing spent eight years, from 1953 to 1961, attending Otter Creek School and had hoped to graduate from high school there.Fate—and a countywide consolidation plan—took her elsewhere, to Garfield
www.tribstar.com www.tribstar.com

"Better CUT than KEYBOARD"
 

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I dont think classes have anything to do with it. i think its the dynamics of kids not playing 3 (or even 1) sports for whatever reason
 
niklz62 said:
I dont think classes have anything to do with it. i think its the dynamics of kids not playing 3 (or even 1) sports for whatever reason
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Revenue streams from close NATURAL geographic rivals have been destroyed by class pairings, with schools traveling unnecessary miles to play unknown schools. Look @ the Sectionals & Regionals.
 
I'm at the Rocktucky gym right now. Just doing a little scouting for wake forest. There's a boat load of rednecks that could go play with that kid that left ISU.
 
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