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North Dakota Fighting Sioux
- Thread starter Chief_Quabachi
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There has been plenty of discussion on the topic, especially from Native Americans... some feel it is offensive and some don't. I'm not American Indian, so I can't really weight in on whether this is offensive or not. However, I believe the NCAA has banned the user of Native American mascots, so it is pointless to fight it.
North Dakota legislators are fighting it.
The article is interesting and goes beyond just the use of American Indian names and iconic symbols;i.e., Fighting Irish.
The article is interesting and goes beyond just the use of American Indian names and iconic symbols;i.e., Fighting Irish.
Yeah... I think they're fighting a losing battle. We live in a politically correct society and that will win out. Plus, the NCAA is a membership based organization and if they feel that strongly, they could simply pull out of the NCAA. Good luck on that, though.
That said, the argument they're making could be extended for ANY mascot to be quite honest since they're stating it is the way the Indians are being portrayed. Fighting Irish... hell, you could even say that certain animal mascots are offensive because of the way they are portrayed -- afterall they are living beings, too.
Oh, and read this: http://www.alexmeske.com/Essays/mascots.htm
Jason, very interesting article which certainly exposes, IMHO, that a vocal minority can create chaos and turmoil.
My high school's athletic nickname was "Aztecs". At center court was the profile of an Indian Chief with a lengthy feathered war bonnet. That was it….nothing cartoonish or degrading. On our warmup top on the left chest was the same image.
I never, ever felt it was demeaning and in fact felt it was a symbol of bravery and a proud culture. I was proud of the iconic image of a noble and proud Indian Chief. Our cheer section never used chants that could be associated with Indian aggression or any inflammable display, inanimate or animated.
Two bits, four bits a dollar……all for the AZTECS, stand up and holler!!!
My high school's athletic nickname was "Aztecs". At center court was the profile of an Indian Chief with a lengthy feathered war bonnet. That was it….nothing cartoonish or degrading. On our warmup top on the left chest was the same image.
I never, ever felt it was demeaning and in fact felt it was a symbol of bravery and a proud culture. I was proud of the iconic image of a noble and proud Indian Chief. Our cheer section never used chants that could be associated with Indian aggression or any inflammable display, inanimate or animated.
Two bits, four bits a dollar……all for the AZTECS, stand up and holler!!!
nwi stater
The Captain Level
My son is a und grad. He states that und is gonna fight this all the way!
Why can Florida can be an Indian tribe mascot and und can't?
And why can't state still use the Indian mascot when there is no sycamore
Indians
More liberal bs
Ofc
Why can Florida can be an Indian tribe mascot and und can't?
And why can't state still use the Indian mascot when there is no sycamore
Indians
More liberal bs
Ofc
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I know this was supposed to cover nicknames as well... looking at the Valley, wonder if Bradley would need to make a change?
I feel like I remember reading on their message board that since theirs was so broad no one had taken offense yet.
Just wait, some group of cowards will get together and decide that they are offended by the "Braves" nickname, since it implies that brave people are better than cowards. Of course, they'll be too scared to actually sue...
How many Aztecs felt it was demeaning?
As to non-Aztecs NOT feeling it was demeaning? Not surprised.
Florida is the Gators
Florida State is the Seminoles. Fla State can BE the Seminoles because they got the APPROVAL from the Seminole Nation of Florida. The Seminole Nation of Oklahoma tried to fight them; FSU, the Seminole Nation of Florida and the NCAA all told the the Seminole Nation of Oklahoma to
off! Why?? Because it was the FLORIDA State Seminoles, NOT the Oklahoma State Seminoles.
Again, the NCAA WILL ALLOW us to USE Chief Quabache; the UNIVERISITY just needs to get the approval of an INDIANA-based Indian Nation; i.e. the Wea, the Miami, the Potawatomi...
And if we WOULD do that, he should be attired CORRECTLY; so NO Great Plains War Bonnets -- it should be something the Wea, Miami, Potawatomi used.
Very easy to do.
Landini mentions the 'removal' of Chief Quabache in his memoirs; bascially, the athletic department / some coaches decided on their own to create the myth, legend, lore of Chief Quabache.
As the Chief as never approved/added officially via the University... it was quite easy to have him removed.
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Hasn't Bradley altered their logos to comply?
They could EASILY pick an logo of an ancient European people and the NCAA wouldn't say boo.
Yes and no because they still have the Cartoon-type character around the campus athletic stuff...
What is interesting about the ESPN article is that UND HAS permission from a North Dakota Sioux Nation; there are two in the state, one has agreed, the other is still fighting it.
What I find particularly interesting about the UND argument; the Sioux don't call THEMSELVES Sioux. They (depending on the division) use Lakota, Yankton and Santee.
So, knowing THAT fact; how CAN either Sioux Nation be 'outraged??'
As to the other article; interesting read, Cleveland would garner a TON of good will if they made Chief Wahoo less of a caricature and a closer likeness of person. The Washington Redskins should change; as simple as that.
There's NO way other groups would stand for the use of slurs, why is Redskins, ok? It not a PC move, it's an acknowledgement that certain words should not be used in "polite company."
Still being sold? OR people are still wearing their old gear?
As long as Bradley isn't selling it; or licensing it for sale -- there's not much the NCAA can do TO Bradley.
For instance, if I want to buy a silk-screening set-up or start embroidering polos, etc -- will the NCAA go after State (using Chief Quabache?) or me?
They SHOULD come after me...
Not sure if they still sell it or not but I was on their campus recently and that stupid cartoony figure is still all over the place.
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Sycamore Proud
The Nicks Level
Remember you are dealing with the NCAA. 'Nuff said.
Re-read this article last night; he makes some interesting points but he completely glosses over the fact that it was American Indian groups who raised this issue; THEY were protesting, it had little to nothing to do with 'white guilt.'
4Q_IU, Back then and before when there was some common sense in this country, NOBODY GAVE A RAT's ASS. It was a non-issue!!
I agree; but today, the Aztecs DO give a rat's a**.
I'm not touching the 'common sense' statement.