Sycamore Hoops 2010-2011 - Redshirts

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IndyTreeFan

The Kleuh Level
Supporter
OK, now that I've been suckered into posting in multiple Butler-related threads today, I thought I'd do my duty and start something related to the real team on here - our beloved Sycamores!!!

2010-2011 looks to be an interesting year for the Trees. A reloading year at some positions, and a rebuilding year at others. In this thread, let's discuss the redshirts that will be freshmen next season:

1. Jake Odum - The hype on Jake is that he is the consummate point guard that we've been missing for several years - a guy that gets just as much of a buzz from finding the open teammate (and creating that opening) as he does from scoring. He's got nice size for a PG, he is a tremendous ballhandler, and his outside shot looks as though it is better than some thought. He showed some flashes of brilliance in the exhibition games last fall, and had some of us salivating at Bird-esque passes that could be filling the HC court for the next four years. There is some concern, however, that his "helter-skelter" type of game won't translate well to D-I, and that his lack of shooting ability will be an enormous hinderence in the MVC. Word on the street is that he's vastly improved his shooting over the redshirt year, and he has really gotten a grasp of the offense he's going to be running for KMac. He's worked extremely hard over the last season, and could be poised to be an impact freshman.

2. RJ Mahurin - a 6'9" Larry Bird clone (type of game, not quality of player) comes to ISU with a reputation as a deadly outside shooter whose size could create problems for opposing defenses. I've heard it said many times from folks at ISU that RJ is the best shooter on the team, an attribute that could be a real headache for opposing coaches, as they presumably won't be able to guard him with a guard, and he'll pull one of the bigs away from the basket. RJ has a really nice feel for the game, and being the son of a coach, is fundamentally sound. Some have been concerned that he will be too slow to play D-I ball, and that his thin frame will not allow him to use his 6'9" body inside to any decent effect. I have heard that he is the most impressive of the redshirts, though, and has not only gained quite a bit of muscle over the past year, he's gained a lot of respect from the coaches. I even heard that one of our coaches speculated that if he wasn't redshirted, he would have been playing 15+ minutes per game for us. That's pretty good for a true freshman, albeit we were very weak inside, but I don't think they were talking about his inside game. Could RJ be the game-changing "sleeper" recruit that we've been longing for?

3. Logan and Lucas Eitel - Sorry I put them together, but I can't tell them apart!!! And, admittedly, being in Indy for the past 10 years, I don't know that much about them. They came to ISU with a reputation as winners who do the work it takes to get the job done. Being walk-ons, I don't think the expectation of starting, or even playing that much, rests on their shoulders. That would merely be a big bonus, and hey, it's happened before! What I've heard is that their attitude alone has made them a valuable addition to the team. These kids are winners, and as you may know, that kind of attitude is infectious on a team. I've also gathered from talking to folks around ISU that one of the two (sorry, can't remember which) looks as though he might be another Harry Marshall, a walk-on that just might develop into an all-conference player. That would be a HUGE bonus, but could sure make for some tense Thanksgiving dinners at the Eitel household...:bigsmile:

From what I've been able to glean from my sources, this group of redshirts are ready to make a big impact for us next year. At the very least, we'll be getting a true PG who knows how to play the position and can handle the ball (finally!), and a forward who knows how to play the game and can shoot the eyes out of the basket. Who knows what else they'll be able to accomplish!

Of course this is all speculation, but that's what these boards are for, right? So what do you all think, know, hear, etc.?

:sycamores::sycamores::sycamores:
 

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That was an extremely positive post...

ITF, thanks for taking the time to post this and get us started on some worthwhile discussion! With that being said, I'm not really surprised by the overly positive nature of your post... lol It will be really interesting to see what these guys do in an actual game, it's going to be a lot different from what people have seen or heard about these guys in practice...

Odum: Like you said, it's a matter of what his 3 point jump shot will look like. I mean he has always had a decent little mid range jumper, but needs to develop a shot from long range. However I don't think it's essential for him to be a successful PG for us, if he has a 3 point shot he will be really difficult to handle. He has plus side athletic ability, plus side ball handler, plus side floor general, plus side basketball IQ and plus side competitor - I don't have any doubt that he will be our starting PG next year!

Projection:

PPG: 9
AST: 4
RBS: 3.5
ST: 1

RJ: I don't think their is any question that RJ can stroke it, no one really questions that part of his game. He needs to prove to me that he can defend bigger players on the defense side of the ball and that he can get in their and rebound the rock. If he can do those 2 things well then I think he will get some decent playing time. If he can't then he is just not going to play much next year. Minutes are going to be hard to come by and my guess is that he will play anywhere from 5 to 15 minutes a game.

Projection:

PPG: 3
AST: 1
RBS: 2
ST: 0

Eitles: Can both play basketball, no doubt about it. Again minutes are going to be hard to come by. I am sure they will get some playing time here and their. My hope is that we will find a group of players that play well enough together that we wont have to reach this far down in our bench. That's not a knock on the Eitles because they are certainly capable of playing at this level in my mind. However if we are going this far down the bench then it might point toward our "top" players not getting the job done. I think the Eitles will have their moment in the spotlight, but that time is not here yet...
 
Morgan, would you believe me if I was anything other than positive? It's just the way I roll...:wordyo:

I just reported what I've heard. I guess RJ has been a tremendous surprise to the staff. Adjusting much better than anticipated...

:sycamores::sycamores::sycamores:
 
Dealing strictly w/ returnees and word of mouth on RS

Wow, Morgan, you're only projecting Jake Odum w/ 4 assists?! IF he's the PG I keep hearing about, I've been expecting an assist number more like 9 a game; maybe you reversed his ppg and apg...

as to RJ; who's going to 'steal minutes' from him on the front line? Martin? Leitnacker?? The JC player is a bit of an unknown until he;s on campus and I'd have to put RJ ahead of the other RS and FROSH for next season; Doluony will obviously get more PT but didn't he run a bit hot and cold this season?

I hope we don't have to play a 4 G lineup next season

Can't speak to the Eitels
 
Wow, Morgan, you're only projecting Jake Odum w/ 4 assists?! IF he's the PG I keep hearing about, I've been expecting an assist number more like 9 a game; maybe you reversed his ppg and apg...

Well 4Q 4 ast. a game would have put him about 4th in the Valley last year in apg. and for a Freshman to be in the top 5 in ast. per game I would say that would be pretty solid. It's the other number that I want to see low, turnovers. If he get's 4 ast. per game and keeps those TO's down around 1 or 2 a game then I would be pretty thrilled with that. I think the ast. will come, it's that other number that I am concerned about.

But 9 ast. a game would be great, that would have put him in the top 5 in the nation last year. Talk about being unrealistic, I was just trying to keep things at an attainable number. Anything over what I projected would be great!
 

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Well 4Q 4 ast. a game would have put him about 4th in the Valley last year in apg. and for a Freshman to be in the top 5 in ast. per game I would say that would be pretty solid. It's the other number that I want to see low, turnovers. If he get's 4 ast. per game and keeps those TO's down around 1 or 2 a game then I would be pretty thrilled with that. I think the ast. will come, it's that other number that I am concerned about.

But 9 ast. a game would be great, that would have put him in the top 5 in the nation last year. Talk about being unrealistic, I was just trying to keep things at an attainable number. Anything over what I projected would be great!

Wasn't trying to be sarcastic/snide/etc; it's just there's been so much talk of him controlling a game THIS season...; as a RS Frosh next season, he'll have some seasoning; he was practicing against the active players this season -- we'll see how he does

Having TOO much talent -- been a while since ISU MBB can make that statement
 
I really hope RJ has done what i thought he needed to do to play at this level with is bulk up about 25 lbs and learn to play post defense. He will never have the foot speed to play the wing, but he could be a good piece for us if he can extend the D with his shooting and then bang bodies down low on D.

Oh and on a side on note i have class with a few players on the team and am friends with a few more and they all say Jake Odum can really play. So hopefully he will live up to the hype. Hard to imagine a yr ago this time he was just getting an offer from the sycamores.
 
There will be a lot of minutes available for Mahurin. It will be interesting to see what he can do with him.
 
Okay, I know this thread is supposed to be about the redshirts, but, are we left asking ourselves the same question this year as last?? Mainly, where does Jake Kelly fit in? From the sound of the posts on this thread, it appears that Jake Odum is going to be playing 35-40 minutes at the point (quite a load for a freshman). The odd man out (once again) is Jake Kelly.

I will concede that it remains to be seen how well he will recover from his surgery...have we gone from too may point guards (at the beginning of the season in 2009) to not enough?

Does this mean that McWhorter does/doesn't get a redshirt (potentially)??

I am just looking for other opinions here.
 
Okay, I know this thread is supposed to be about the redshirts, but, are we left asking ourselves the same question this year as last?? Mainly, where does Jake Kelly fit in? From the sound of the posts on this thread, it appears that Jake Odum is going to be playing 35-40 minutes at the point (quite a load for a freshman). The odd man out (once again) is Jake Kelly.

I will concede that it remains to be seen how well he will recover from his surgery...have we gone from too may point guards (at the beginning of the season in 2009) to not enough?

Does this mean that McWhorter does/doesn't get a redshirt (potentially)??

I am just looking for other opinions here.

I think that if he's healthy (a BIG if), PG is Jake's position. Odum would most likely be Jake's backup, I would think, although you could easily see them both on the court at the same time. All these guards should make pressing more effective, don't you think?
 

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Okay, I know this thread is supposed to be about the redshirts, but, are we left asking ourselves the same question this year as last?? Mainly, where does Jake Kelly fit in? From the sound of the posts on this thread, it appears that Jake Odum is going to be playing 35-40 minutes at the point (quite a load for a freshman). The odd man out (once again) is Jake Kelly.

I will concede that it remains to be seen how well he will recover from his surgery...have we gone from too may point guards (at the beginning of the season in 2009) to not enough?

Does this mean that McWhorter does/doesn't get a redshirt (potentially)??

I am just looking for other opinions here.

We don't know yet how JO is going to do. I would suggest, as a freshmen, he will be a little inconsistent. If he plays 20-25 min at PG, then Kelly will have 15 at PG and 15 at 2G. Printy/Carter/Lathan will cover the 25 more min at 2g and most of the 3. The 4/5 will be the best 4 out of many. the minutes at 4/5 might be competitive OR they could be obvious when the season starts.
Coach has mentioned that McWhorter could play right away. That would be interesting. If he competes with Odum for minutes, that is really good news for us. But, everyone may not be able to play.

this is ten folks:

Odum, Kelly, Printy, Lathan, Carter, Richard, Doluony, RJ, Martin, Walker

Will any of these slide into the group above and knock one of them out?

McWhorter, Leitnaker, Kitchell
 
To start next year, I think you'll see this lineup:

Kelly
Lathan
Carter
Richard
Walker

Odum, Printy, Martin, RJ, and Doluony will get plenty of opportunities to unseat them in the early going. Leitnaker will hopefully just be depth. It seems to me that we have 3 guys who can comfortably bring the ball up the floor, along with Printy for emergencies. Both Eitel's will also be on the bench. Printy is a sniper off the bench who'll hopefully develop more of a nose for the dribble drive. To me, the backcourt seems deep enough that McWhorter can redshirt. I know, some of you will point to this year to say I'm wrong. You have your opinion, this is mine. :sycamores:

Inside, I still think it will come down to whether or not Kitchell adds 15-20 lbs. of muscle before November. If so, he should play. If not, we might be better off redshirting him too. Walker, Richard, Doluony, Martin, RJ, and Brant should provide adequate depth if Kitchell can't be an immediate impact guy, IMO.
 
I think Odum, Kelly, Lathan, and Richard are sure-thing starters and the 5th spot is up for grabs.

But hey, I wouldn't argue with any lineup right now. We are deeper than we have ever been, even compared to 79, 00, or 01.
 
I think Odum, Kelly, Lathan, and Richard are sure-thing starters and the 5th spot is up for grabs.

But hey, I wouldn't argue with any lineup right now. We are deeper than we have ever been, even compared to 79, 00, or 01.
I would have zero problem with Odum starting, but it'd be hard to justify having all three of your best ball handlers on the floor at the same with your two best outside shooters on the bench. For balance purposes, I think Odum starts on the bench but still plays 20 minutes. I'm REALLY excited to see how it all shakes out though. Hoping my Indy job interview comes through too...a 1 hour drive is close enough for season tickets, right???

:sycamores::sycamores:
 
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