Todd Golden: An open letter to President Curtis

[Southgrad07]

Well thought out piece here! I would highly suggest people let our new President know that we are on board with Mr.Golden's train of thought here and want to see something followed through on after its completion. The new HC is truly a GOLDEN (pun intended :biggrin opportunity that we cannot afford to waste!

http://www.tribstar.com/sports/loca...cle_26e91b10-57ce-5d4f-ac9e-27dff9dec002.html



Assuming her email is the same as Bradley's- https://www.indstate.edu/about/administration/president/staff

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Quite frankly I don't see the path to success that Golden mentions with a football program... It's all fine and good in theory but nothing changes unless you're willing to make a really really difficult decisions and they are not willing. They continue to make small investments in Memorial Stadium - new lights (for one freaking night game), new field turf etc. I think they are showing the viewing public that they're committed to the football program. Given that level of commitment and the current financial state of our athletic department I don't see a clear path to the top of the MVC or midmajor hoops.

Good article - but he tip toed around this issue and failed to address the reasons success has been hard to come by. Basically pinned it all on fan/community support and how that has correlated to the financial position of the athletic department. As good as Bradley was they still have some internal soul searching to do before they can go just start asking the public to give more than they already have. What are you going to call on the same local donors who already give?

At the end of the day - if football alumni want to start giving money back to the University to support the product then I can get on board with them. If they want to sit ideally like they have for the past decade then this article fails to point out the real issue(s) that this athletic department is faced with and the real reason that basketball and other sports can't be consistently successful.

 

[Southgrad07]

Quite frankly I don't see the path to success that Golden mentions with a football program... It's all fine and good in theory but nothing changes unless you're willing to make a really really difficult decisions and they are not willing. They continue to make small investments in Memorial Stadium - new lights (for one freaking night game), new field turf etc. I think they are showing the viewing public that they're committed to the football program. Given that level of commitment and the current financial state of our athletic department I don't see a clear path to the top of the MVC or midmajor hoops.

Not even an hour in and you had to open the football can of worms didn't you?? lol..I agree that we will not ever reach the ceiling we could with our current commitment to football..But if in the next few years they would divert some of that what 4mil a year? from fb and get us closer to the middle of the pack in bb and actually have well known fundraiser specifically targeted for mbb to acknowledge that- yes this is our flagship program going forward...That would be enough to get the ball rolling into a more consistently competitive program..I just like the awareness that he is raising by saying a state of the art HC is something to built upon rather than looked at as the end game for program growth.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Not even an hour in and you had to open the football can of worms didn't you?? lol..I agree that we will not ever reach the ceiling we could with our current commitment to football..But if in the next few years they would divert some of that what 4mil a year? from fb and get us closer to the middle of the pack in bb and actually have well known fundraiser specifically targeted for mbb to acknowledge that- yes this is our flagship program going forward...That would be enough to get the ball rolling into a more consistently competitive program..I just like the awareness that he is raising by saying a state of the art HC is something to built upon rather than looked at as the end game for program growth.

Love the article. Love where his mind is at.

Just have trouble letting my imagination run wild at the possibilities.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

Not sure I get Golden mentioning a path to success with the football program? Also, if basketball is going to get a bigger slice of the athletics pie, it would be coming out of the football portion, no? I honestly doubt the school is over indulging in non-revenue sports in any sort of way.

Outside of that, he's basically just writing what we've all been saying here for a decade.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Not sure I get Golden mentioning a path to success with the football program? Also, if basketball is going to get a bigger slice of the athletics pie, it would be coming out of the football portion, no? I honestly doubt the school is over indulging in non-revenue sports in any sort of way.

Outside of that, he's basically just writing what we've all been saying here for a decade.

He didn’t mention football at all.

Apparently I’ve not been articulating myself very well lately.

I don’t see the path to success in hoops without addressing football. He addressed the issue without directly mentioning football.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

He didn’t mention football at all.

Apparently I’ve not been articulating myself very well lately.

I don’t see the path to success in hoops without addressing football. He addressed the issue without directly mentioning football.

Well he did mention the MVFC when he mentioned discussion about moving to the OVC.

But again, if basketball is going to get a bigger piece of the athletic's budget, it's coming from football wouldn't you think? Which pretty much ties into your point because if they pull money out of that program, can Mallory win? If the OpEd numbers are right, football accounts for 33.9% of our total yearly athletic's budget -- $3.9m of $11.5m. Basketball, by comparison, was 15.9% at $1.8m.

https://ope.ed.gov/athletics

Unless he is expecting for her to solve Indiana State's long time donor issue or putting more University money in?

 

[eagletree]

We say that basketball is our main sport (and I believe it is too) but attendance at football games is higher than basketball. That does seem to show interest. Yes, I agree that attendance for both sports is horrible. I don't ever remember a season where our basketball attendance has been as poor as this year.

 

[Southgrad07]

Not sure I get Golden mentioning a path to success with the football program? Also, if basketball is going to get a bigger slice of the athletics pie, it would be coming out of the football portion, no? I honestly doubt the school is over indulging in non-revenue sports in any sort of way.

Outside of that, he's basically just writing what we've all been saying here for a decade.

Yep. It's nothing that hasn't been stated countless times here...Nice to see him put it out to a larger/new audience.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

We say that basketball is our main sport (and I believe it is too) but attendance at football games is higher than basketball. That does seem to show interest. Yes, I agree that attendance for both sports is horrible. I don't ever remember a season where our basketball attendance has been as poor as this year.

A couple things to think about:

- Football attendance is also propped up thanks to Homecoming. If you take out that statistical outlier, I believe the average falls below basketball. Basketball has no "special event" outlier anymore since they got rid of the Ballyhoo/ServPro "sell out" event.

- Comparing average attendance is apples to oranges. When you're looking at revenues, total attendance is what matters. Total attendance for football last year was 25,763 and basketball was 55,243. Also, average seat prices for basketball are higher and there was a seat donation on top of that. I'd imagine ticket sale revenues for hoops dwarf football. That is something Jennifer Cook could probably verify if they wish.

- Think of "best case scenario" for each program and which would bring the University more national exposure which SHOULD equate to more students, more donors, etc. I don't think a NCAA title is realistic for hoops, so let's use Butler's rise as a test case vs. North Dakota State. Did Butler's "Sweet 16-to-Final 4" run over a decade bring that school greater exposure than North Dakota State's five FCS championships and getting ready to play for their 6th in 7 years? Without a doubt.

Again, just some points to ponder.

 

[eagletree]

I definitely agree with those points. I believe though the reason we do get more per football games is the game experience is just better thought out. Tailgating is always a plus. I agree there are NO special days for basketball. Not sure why they gave up days like: Clay County Day, Boys and Girls Club Day, Sullivan County Day, honor roll day, etc. They used to make tickets available for like a dollar or so to groups like that. So far we have not had a fraternity and sorority night, 80's night, or similar. I think it just takes that little extra effort to put a few more warm bodies in the seats. Also, I would like to see ISU rethink the season ticket policy. Maybe only the very middle seats need to be 25 dollars, the next section 15, and the lower end zones 6. Not sure at this point we even need to sell upper bowl season tickets (though I have 5). Ha Leave those as general admission. Just a thought.

 

[TreeTop]

I definitely agree with those points. I believe though the reason we do get more per football games is the game experience is just better thought out. Tailgating is always a plus. I agree there are NO special days for basketball. Not sure why they gave up days like: Clay County Day, Boys and Girls Club Day, Sullivan County Day, honor roll day, etc. They used to make tickets available for like a dollar or so to groups like that. So far we have not had a fraternity and sorority night, 80's night, or similar. I think it just takes that little extra effort to put a few more warm bodies in the seats. Also, I would like to see ISU rethink the season ticket policy. Maybe only the very middle seats need to be 25 dollars, the next section 15, and the lower end zones 6. Not sure at this point we even need to sell upper bowl season tickets (though I have 5). Ha Leave those as general admission. Just a thought.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">ISU hosts Drake on Saturday, January 6 at 2 pm (ET) inside Hulman Center.<br><br>For $7 you get to watch two of the top MVC teams play, a FREE Mountain Dew from Pepsi, a FREE Sonic Cheeseburger, chance to win FREE Qdoba Chips & Queso & Chic Fil A<br><br>&#55356;&#57247; <a href="https://t.co/MiPRH76guy">https://t.co/MiPRH76guy</a></p>— Ace Hunt (@SycamoreSID) <a href="https://twitter.com/SycamoreSID/status/948949441762988034?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 4, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[meistro]

Very good article and spot on.

 

[bent20]

Think of "best case scenario" for each program and which would bring the University more national exposure which SHOULD equate to more students, more donors, etc. I don't think a NCAA title is realistic for hoops, so let's use Butler's rise as a test case vs. North Dakota State. Did Butler's "Sweet 16-to-Final 4" run over a decade bring that school greater exposure than North Dakota State's five FCS championships and getting ready to play for their 6th in 7 years? Without a doubt.

So long as MVC teams still can qualify for the NCAA tournament (and really, at this point it's just the MVC tournament champion that's going to qualify going forward), there is no doubt basketball offers us the greatest opportunity at national exposure. Even a first round upset offers the school great publicity.

Here is a question, which do you think would earn a school more publicity? Reaching the Sweet 16, or winning the FCS championship?

How many people even know James Madison won the FCS last year?

And ... people no doubt know North Dakota State football more for its upsets of FBS teams than they do for the winning all of those FCS championships.

That said, our chances of reaching the NCAA tournament and making a run, might face longer odds than of us reaching the FCS playoffs and winning a game or two. And yes, I realize we just went without a win this season, just saying it's "easier" or at least should be easier, to reach the playoffs as an MVC football team than it is to reach the NCAA tournament (more spots, don't have to be nearly as perfect).

 

[sycamore tuff]

So long as MVC teams still can qualify for the NCAA tournament (and really, at this point it's just the MVC tournament champion that's going to qualify going forward), there is no doubt basketball offers us the greatest opportunity at national exposure. Even a first round upset offers the school great publicity.

Here is a question, which do you think would earn a school more publicity? Reaching the Sweet 16, or winning the FCS championship?

How many people even know James Madison won the FCS last year?

And ... people no doubt know North Dakota State football more for its upsets of FBS teams than they do for the winning all of those FCS championships.

That said, our chances of reaching the NCAA tournament and making a run, might face longer odds than of us reaching the FCS playoffs and winning a game or two. And yes, I realize we just went without a win this season, just saying it's "easier" or at least should be easier, to reach the playoffs as an MVC football team than it is to reach the NCAA tournament (more spots, don't have to be nearly as perfect).

I would think the donors and alumni of JMU know they won it. Therefore football is very important to them as it should be to us!

 

[bent20]

I would think the donors and alumni of JMU know they won it. Therefore football is very important to them as it should be to us!

It certainly is for some of them. I have two cousins who are JMU alums and I can say for a fact they're quite proud. They're also big sports fans though. For the more casual fan - the ones you're going to lose to other big in-state schools - not so much. Trust me, I'm sure there are a lot of Wichita State fanatics, who as recently as 10 years ago could have cared less about their program and were instead Kansas fanatics. Winning on the big stage gets you noticed more and gets you those fringe fans, who like it or not, you need in order to fill the stands, make money and be more successful on a consistent basis.

 

[EvilleSycamore]

Golden contradicts himself, he applauds Bradley for “fully funding” ALL sports at ISU, then at the end of his open letter he says basketball should get “A bigger piece of the pie”. Unless that Pie is supersized there is not room to basically double what is spent on basketball as with his example of Greg Losings salary for that position needs to be double. I agree with him it should be more for a better coach and you get what you pay for but I don’t think the programs who are winning such as Cross country, track, swimming, volleyball must suffer by making their piece of the pie is smaller to make basketball bigger.. now the question is where does the supersizing come from to make all programs viable. Let’s hope Sherrod is out buying Powerball tix to make it work.

 

[Sycamore Proud]

A couple things to think about:

- Football attendance is also propped up thanks to Homecoming. If you take out that statistical outlier, I believe the average falls below basketball. Basketball has no "special event" outlier anymore since they got rid of the Ballyhoo/ServPro "sell out" event.

- Comparing average attendance is apples to oranges. When you're looking at revenues, total attendance is what matters. Total attendance for football last year was 25,763 and basketball was 55,243. Also, average seat prices for basketball are higher and there was a seat donation on top of that. I'd imagine ticket sale revenues for hoops dwarf football. That is something Jennifer Cook could probably verify if they wish.

- Think of "best case scenario" for each program and which would bring the University more national exposure which SHOULD equate to more students, more donors, etc. I don't think a NCAA title is realistic for hoops, so let's use Butler's rise as a test case vs. North Dakota State. Did Butler's "Sweet 16-to-Final 4" run over a decade bring that school greater exposure than North Dakota State's five FCS championships and getting ready to play for their 6th in 7 years? Without a doubt.

Again, just some points to ponder.

Can't help but wonder:

Would you feel the same way if you lived near Fargo? Does it matter that Indy has 8 times the population of Fargo? If IS had the success of either program do you see moving to a P5 conference or strong hoops league coming to fruition? Do you see the image/character of ISU match that of a power conference?

I'm not sure about any of these. Interested in your views on this.

 

[Sycamorefan96]

National exposure isn't really as big of an issue as you'd think. NDSU sells out their 18,000 seat dome every home game for football. Then add to the fact that they get an additional 3 home games (that they sell out once again) in the FCS playoffs every year. Football is their cash cow. I'm also pretty sure their fans don't care what other people's opinions are on their football team and why should they?

 

[Jason Svoboda]

Can't help but wonder:

Would you feel the same way if you lived near Fargo? Does it matter that Indy has 8 times the population of Fargo? If IS had the success of either program do you see moving to a P5 conference or strong hoops league coming to fruition? Do you see the image/character of ISU match that of a power conference?

I'm not sure about any of these. Interested in your views on this.

1) If I were a North Dakota State fan? No. That's because their primary sport and breadwinner is football and they have visions of moving up to FBS eventually. Every situation is different.

2) If we won like North Dakota State in football, moved to FBS, would I be interested in moving up to the MAC and becoming an annual participant in the Motor City Bowl? No. I don't care what anyone says, there is no value playing low level FBS football. If we won consistently like Butler and got offered a spot in the Big East? Absolutely. But we don't fit that conference profile. If you're saying won like Butler only to move up to the MAC. No, because we then have to put a TON of money into football only to likely suffer the same fate as all of their schools -- they literally SET FIRE to piles of cash.

3) No, we don't. And that's okay.