You're the AD... what would you do?

[Jason Svoboda]

This is a spinoff question from the FCS thread for everyone. Some of you know the behind-the-scenes details here so I'm not going to name names but since home-and-home series and traditional rivals are important, what would you do here?

Let's say there is a school that is a traditional football rival of ours and we previously had a home-and-home series with. Let's also say said school cancelled that series because our hoops team stated they no longer wanted to schedule said school because of their historically low RPI and lower conference stature. If you were Ron Prettyman, how do you handle this scenario? Do you:

1) Let the hoops squad have their way and not schedule said team and lose out of the football series or;
2) Make the hoops squad schedule them so the football series can resume and try to make up the RPI loss elsewhere?

 

[IndyTreeFan]

This is a spinoff question from the FCS thread for everyone. Some of you know the behind-the-scenes details here so I'm not going to name names but since home-and-home series and traditional rivals are important, what would you do here?

Let's say there is a school that is a traditional football rival of ours and we previously had a home-and-home series with. Let's also say said school cancelled that series because our hoops team stated they no longer wanted to schedule said school because of their historically low RPI and lower conference stature. If you were Ron Prettyman, how do you handle this scenario? Do you:

1) Let the hoops squad have their way and not schedule said team and lose out of the football series or;
2) Make the hoops squad schedule them so the football series can resume and try to make up the RPI loss elsewhere?

I think I go with #2. For goodness' sake, it's not like we don't play some pretty bad teams every year. Go take a buy game at a BCS school (in basketball) and make it up. The football team needs help, too. And they have fewer games with which to get the help.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

This is a spinoff question from the FCS thread for everyone. Some of you know the behind-the-scenes details here so I'm not going to name names but since home-and-home series and traditional rivals are important, what would you do here?

Let's say there is a school that is a traditional football rival of ours and we previously had a home-and-home series with. Let's also say said school cancelled that series because our hoops team stated they no longer wanted to schedule said school because of their historically low RPI and lower conference stature. If you were Ron Prettyman, how do you handle this scenario? Do you:

1) Let the hoops squad have their way and not schedule said team and lose out of the football series or;
2) Make the hoops squad schedule them so the football series can resume and try to make up the RPI loss elsewhere?

Option A.

For the simple reason that the Hoops team is a D1 and football is a D1AA. I think that the Hoops team RPI is a very real issue and something that teams look at, espeically mid majors. If the Sycamores had replaced some of this high rated rpi non conference road games the last couple of years with said rival school school then we likely wouldn't have even been in th at-large convo the past couple years.

I think good loss vs. high RPI is better than a win vs. a low RPI and oh by the way, no assurance of us winning those low RPI games.

For me this isn't even close - the answer is pretty obvious. We have a hard time filling our non confrence schedual every year.

 

[bent20]

I've made this point before, I think, but when was the last time the RPI got us into an NCAA Tournament we didn't otherwise qualify for by winning the conference tournament? And when has it ever given us a really high seed in the tournament? We talk about it all the time, but our RPI is amost never really relavent. I guess maybe it helps with scheduling, but if we're good enough to have a better RPI our success can also be a deterrent to teams wanting an easier win.

And as already stated, we struggle with scheduling even mediocre competition in basketball, so why not take the home and home and be content? EIU is already better in basketball than some of the teams we've played in recent years.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

Added a poll.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

I've made this point before, I think, but when was the last time the RPI got us into an NCAA Tournament we didn't otherwise qualify for by winning the conference tournament? And when has it ever given us a really high seed in the tournament? We talk about it all the time, but our RPI is amost never really relavent. I guess maybe it helps with scheduling, but if we're good enough to have a better RPI our success can also be a deterrent to teams wanting an easier win.

And as already stated, we struggle with scheduling even mediocre competition in basketball, so why not take the home and home and be content? EIU is already better in basketball than some of the teams we've played in recent years.

Just because the RPI hasn't helped us yet, doesn't make it any less important for a mid major. Because if your program is where you want it to be - like several mid majors, the RPI is very important. So just becaus it hasn't helped us doesn't mean you discount it. Fact od the matter is we were about 2 wins from it helping us last year and that number alone kept us in the convo. much longer than we deserved.

It's like saying, I've been running 3 days a week but haven't lost any weight. Since I haven't lost any weight I should just stop exercising - in other words, since we haven't seen the benefit it's doesn't matter.

You simply can't approach it like that.

Let me understand this, so far 4 people to my 1 have voted for option 2 for these reasons:

- It's not like we don't play some pretty bad teams every year.

- Our RPI is almost never really relevant.

If those are the two best posts in support of option 2 then I need to give this up - I'm wasting my life here. And is it worth mentioning that EIU and Ball State is on this years hoops sched. What are we discussing here.

 

[SycamoreFan317]

It is tougher to schedule for basketball than football so advantage basketball. Basketball brings in more money than football advantage basketball. When football earns it's stripes and brings in more fans then we give it more consideration but I have to give the advantage to the sport that has been carrying the bulk of the athletic department for a number of years now.

 

[bent20]

If we reach a point where we can start scheduling better teams in basketball then maybe we don't renew the contract when it's up again. You know, do what Butler did to us. For now, regularly scheduling EIU looks like a win for both of our programs. If our football program could make a playoff appearance or two (and the odds would be improved by playing more FCS schools), it might become a better draw than it already is. We need to give both sports a fighting chance.

 

[SycamoreStateofMind]

If we reach a point where we can start scheduling better teams in basketball then maybe we don't renew the contract when it's up again. You know, do what Butler did to us. For now, regularly scheduling EIU looks like a win for both of our programs. If our football program could make a playoff appearance or two (and the odds would be improved by playing more FCS schools), it might become a better draw than it already is. We need to give both sports a fighting chance.

Much better. I can accept that. Come on though BENT, trying to brig that stale bread (old argument) to the dinner table, I aint letting that fly. You kno damn good and well the RPI does matter - I won't let you stand on that foot.

 

[bent20]

It definitely can matter, if we could ever finish strong enough to make it meaningful. Maybe this is the year.

Plus, I really believe EIU is a common sense rival. One where we have the tradition, at least in football, and you have ideal proximity. And I've always enjoyed Charleston.

 

[SycamoreFan317]

It definitely can matter, if we could ever finish strong enough to make it meaningful. Maybe this is the year.

Plus, I really believe EIU is a common sense rival. One where we have the tradition, at least in football, and you have ideal proximity. And I've always enjoyed Charleston.

So as AD you would add an opponent because you like their city? I have been answering as it were a business decision not a personal decision because I LOVE football. I agree with SSOM it is too big of a risk RPI wise to justify. The students on campus now know nothing about the tradition of yesterday with EIU, Butler or BSU. There is no current rival in football or basketball. Basketball and subsidies pay the bills, so they get preference.

 

[SycamoreTree]

I think we can build a great rivalry with Ball State both in basketball and Football. They should Hype the games up more. or what would even be more awesome is a Neutral game in Indy for both football and basketball.

 

[Bluethunder]

Schedule Them in football to help that program get a better opponent, add them to the schedule in basketball and drop another program like IUPUI (a wash at worst, an improvement at best).

Win for football, win (or at least break even) for basketball.

 

[bent20]

So as AD you would add an opponent because you like their city? I have been answering as it were a business decision not a personal decision because I LOVE football. I agree with SSOM it is too big of a risk RPI wise to justify. The students on campus now know nothing about the tradition of yesterday with EIU, Butler or BSU. There is no current rival in football or basketball. Basketball and subsidies pay the bills, so they get preference.

For those students who get into the games, it's a short drive to EIU. It makes sense. And yes, liking the town matters. I want to know the students will be safe there.

 

[bent20]

I think we can build a great rivalry with Ball State both in basketball and Football. They should Hype the games up more. or what would even be more awesome is a Neutral game in Indy for both football and basketball.

We already play them every year in basketball. If it's not already a rivalry then it's not likely to become more of one. As for football, they hold the advantage and they're not going to schedule us home and away. Look at what they just did with Ill. State.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

I think we can build a great rivalry with Ball State both in basketball and Football. They should Hype the games up more. or what would even be more awesome is a Neutral game in Indy for both football and basketball.

Ball State has no incentive to play us and we honestly have zero incentive to play them.

If they lose, they're immediately out of major bowl contention if they had a special year. If they win, they were expected to and voters will ding them for not scheduling up to try to improve their resume. We're not a household name so we're not going to draw fans to Muncie. Hell, we've played at IU in back-to-back seasons and I'd venture a guess that we only had a thousand or so fans there in either year.

As for us, if we're going to play one money game per year, Ball State isn't going to pay what an Indiana will. That is the program's yearly opportunity to bring in some cash to the athletic programs. Further, if we can't get fans to travel to Bloomington or West Lafayette, what makes you think they'll travel to Muncie? We struggle to get our fans to travel a couple miles to Memorial.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

Schedule Them in football to help that program get a better opponent, add them to the schedule in basketball and drop another program like IUPUI (a wash at worst, an improvement at best).

Win for football, win (or at least break even) for basketball.

Correct. Or, you could drop Truman State, Maryville, Oakland City, etc.

 

[SycamoreFan317]

I think that Bent and Jason have a personal agenda here they are on. Jason, if our fans won't drive the 50 miles to Bloomington what makes you think they will drive the 50 miles to Charleston. I am sorry you were not around in the past to see the crowds we had at past games with BSU. Until a team can draw at home it will not draw on the road.....anywhere!!! As I said in another thread I would gladly take 300 to 350K that was paid ISU R over a 400 to 450K from a Big Ten school for we would at least have a fighting chance. BSU went to the Beef O'Brady bowl last year as a .500 team. Their chance of going to a major bowl on any year is dismal at best. As for the votes in polls well I guess you just made the Big Tens case for not scheduling FCS also.

Bent, really, is that the best you can do. I guess you missed the poll that just came out that rated Munice higher than Terre Haute. If safety is such a big issue for you then I guess we better stop sending our students to St. Louis and Chicago. Last of all, ISU R shot themselves down in the second half with questionable play calling and turnovers more than BSU out playing them.

 

[bent20]

I don't have any personal allegiance to Charleston or EIU, I just think scheduling them makes more sense for many of the reasons stated. Maybe I do like the town better simply because I've been there more than I have Muncie, but that's because it's that close to Terre Haute. I think the personal agenda is more for fans who have friends or family who attended Ball State. As has been stated, I don't see the advantage in playing them regularly, as if that could happen in the first place. The best we might get is a deal like the one we've given Quincy, but that's not going to build a rivalry, it's going to build resentment.

 

[Jason Svoboda]

I think that Bent and Jason have a personal agenda here they are on. Jason, if our fans won't drive the 50 miles to Bloomington what makes you think they will drive the 50 miles to Charleston. I am sorry you were not around in the past to see the crowds we had at past games with BSU. Until a team can draw at home it will not draw on the road.....anywhere!!! As I said in another thread I would gladly take 300 to 350K that was paid ISU R over a 400 to 450K from a Big Ten school for we would at least have a fighting chance. BSU went to the Beef O'Brady bowl last year as a .500 team. Their chance of going to a major bowl on any year is dismal at best. As for the votes in polls well I guess you just made the Big Tens case for not scheduling FCS also.

The crux of the discussion should be focused on getting our football team quality, evenly matched opponents so our football team actually has a legit shot at making the playoffs. The same way FBS teams try to enhance their resume and look good to voters, a win over EIU is going to carry more weight to the FCS voters than a loss to Ball State.