I would argue that we also need a really good PG who isn't a midget. Hall was good enough, but he was no threat on the drive because he's short. At least by D-I basketball standards.
Become a Supporting Member to remove this ad and help support the site.
2026-2027 Eligibility Chart
- Thread starter Jason Svoboda
- Start date
WANTED: Passionate Sycamore Fanatics. That You?
Register NOW to join our community of die-hard Sycamore fans.
Become a Supporting Member to remove this ad and help support the site.
Yeah if you are his size besides speed you have to be a dynamic scorer like Swope or be a bit bulky like the Johnson kid for Bradley.
I hope you are right. My thought process was we had a decent hold over from last year that helped speed the process up for new guys. If we have nearly a complete new roster next year, do the players have enough time to get the system down before we're looking up at everyone from the bottom of the conference? While I understand we don't realistically have a chance at an at large bid, it's still important for fan engagement and monetary support to have a good regular season record. I would imagine they would all have it down well by the conference tournament, but an MVC team has never won 4 games in four days there, so a top 5 finish is very important.
SycamoreBlue3209
The Newsom Level
Of which we had none of those this season. Every single one of our guys would have been a nice piece…coming off the bench..
This is an incredibly interesting thought that I hadn’t considered.
Become a Supporting Member to remove this ad and help support the site.
I hope we know rather quickly who is staying (if any) and who is going. I hope with increased resources our coaches can identify and land better talent. I knew last year when our first signee was from the NAIA ranks we were in trouble. I was right. We need D-1 caliber players. Honestly, I don't know why we don't look at the JUCO ranks more. Those players are only around a couple years (which is the norm now anyway).
I would also like to add it seems we need a better player development coach on staff. I never saw ANY signs of player improvement over the course of the season.
I’ll take another Ian Scott any day.
Scott was a great add. The problem was that if the roster was properly constructed, he would have been a great 6th man, not our best player.
DyedBlue
The All-MVC Level
I disagree. If our roster had had a better scoring threat at a couple of positions, it would have opened things up for him even more. Just look at how teams started playing the pocket pass rather than defending the driver as the season progressed.
There is nothing wrong with recruiting quality NAIA players. Not every NAIA first-team All-American was an impact player at D1, but they seem to have all found a role.
Samaje Morgan - playing in Europe. Used up eligibility
Tristan Smith - Integral part of UNI's MVC Tournament Title team. His injury led to UNI's mid-season slump.
Anthony Johnson - Arizona State
Lucas Lorenzen - WIU, OK a bad team but he was its leading scorer this season
Peyton Law: South Alabama. 6'7" forward; 65% FG; Hurt in December but in first 10 games or so average 25.6 mpg and 12.8 ppg
Chaze Harris: South Alabama, two NAIA All americans there and it went 21-10 on the season. 6'6" G; started 32 games; 4.8 Rbd/game
Ian Scott Indiana State - Trees best and most consistent player
Alton Hamilton, Eastern Wash. U. 31 games started13.2 ppg; 27.6 mpg; 5.7 Rbds/game
Kashie Natt - Sam Houston State, 21-10 on season, 6'3" G, 26 mpg, 39% from 3; 80% FT; 7.9 Rbd/game; 10.4 ppg; 2/1 A/TO ratio
CJ Hall, SIUE, played in 29 games, 13.1 mpg, 33% from 3; 65% FT,
Derrick Talton, Buffalo, 31 GP/9 GS; 25.7 mpg; 5'10" G; mediocre stats
Kaleb Lowery, Nevada, 6'8" F; 17.5 mpg; 3.2 apg; 21 GS/30GP; 48% FG; 32% from 3; 70% FT; 26/14 A/TO ratio
There is nothing wrong with recruiting quality NAIA players. Not every NAIA first-team All-American was an impact player at D1, but they seem to have all found a role.
Samaje Morgan - playing in Europe. Used up eligibility
Tristan Smith - Integral part of UNI's MVC Tournament Title team. His injury led to UNI's mid-season slump.
Anthony Johnson - Arizona State
Lucas Lorenzen - WIU, OK a bad team but he was its leading scorer this season
Peyton Law: South Alabama. 6'7" forward; 65% FG; Hurt in December but in first 10 games or so average 25.6 mpg and 12.8 ppg
Chaze Harris: South Alabama, two NAIA All americans there and it went 21-10 on the season. 6'6" G; started 32 games; 4.8 Rbd/game
Ian Scott Indiana State - Trees best and most consistent player
Alton Hamilton, Eastern Wash. U. 31 games started13.2 ppg; 27.6 mpg; 5.7 Rbds/game
Kashie Natt - Sam Houston State, 21-10 on season, 6'3" G, 26 mpg, 39% from 3; 80% FT; 7.9 Rbd/game; 10.4 ppg; 2/1 A/TO ratio
CJ Hall, SIUE, played in 29 games, 13.1 mpg, 33% from 3; 65% FT,
Derrick Talton, Buffalo, 31 GP/9 GS; 25.7 mpg; 5'10" G; mediocre stats
Kaleb Lowery, Nevada, 6'8" F; 17.5 mpg; 3.2 apg; 21 GS/30GP; 48% FG; 32% from 3; 70% FT; 26/14 A/TO ratio
Become a Supporting Member to remove this ad and help support the site.
I disagree also. A potential all-conference is not a 6th man.
CardLake49
The Captain Level
I don't understand the argument that we'll have more money so now we'll be able to have a better roster. Either you can identify talent or you can't. Next year it sounds like we'll be in a different spending bracket than we are now. How does that alone help determine our evaluating ability? What else is going to change? We clearly couldn't identify talent to fit what we needed with the funds we had available this season. What makes me think we'll be able to bring in the right dudes just because we have an extra mil or 2 or whatever we'll have? All it does is allows us to get in the room to talk to dudes with supposedly more talent. At the end of the day we still will have to bring in the right dudes.
There are houses being sold for 100k that have solid structures and houses being sold for 100k that are lemons. Same goes for houses at the 300k level, 500k level and so on. If I don't know what questions to ask or what to look for I'm going to fall into a trap no matter what my housing budget is. If we can't identify talent at our current level all we're going to do is make more expensive messes if nothing else changes. I really hope my opinion is wrong. I'd love nothing more than to eat my words in a year.
There are houses being sold for 100k that have solid structures and houses being sold for 100k that are lemons. Same goes for houses at the 300k level, 500k level and so on. If I don't know what questions to ask or what to look for I'm going to fall into a trap no matter what my housing budget is. If we can't identify talent at our current level all we're going to do is make more expensive messes if nothing else changes. I really hope my opinion is wrong. I'd love nothing more than to eat my words in a year.
Nonsense. I took my 20k to a Porsche dealer the other day and they sent me to the Kia dealer.
If you don't understand the market system, you must have skipped your Econ 101 classes.
Last edited:
I mean hell - how would you be eating your words? This is nothing other than a factual observation and judging on history - you have your doubts. I think it’s all very fair.
Even if they are good next year - the post above is still very relevant.
I’m exhausted by this…
I think its been said here but worth repeating; money raises your floor. Evaluation raises your ceiling. Not sure you attended Econ class either, or maybe you just don’t understand how the portal actually works?
There is a finite pool of players who can genuinely move the needle, and every program with NIL money is chasing the same guys. That’s not Econ 101, that’s a supply problem. More dollars don’t create more elite players.
And let’s not forget, basketball has always been a team sport. Everyone in this thread agrees on that. So at some point, no matter how much money your program has, you still have to evaluate talent, build chemistry, and construct a roster that actually functions as a unit. You can’t actually “buy” any of that.
The programs that are winning this era aren’t just outspending people, they’re out-evaluating them. Graves hit on Teel in year one and Camp in year one. In year two hit on Scott. Who else has been a hit? I’ll wait. Three dudes in two years will not get it done. Which brings to one final point that ya’all are not realizing.
By Indiana state publicly saying they’ve got more money to spend and they’re going to be in a position to be a “buyer” - they’re also taking away an excuse for not winning. Because every coach in the country who doesn’t win is going to immediately say, they lack the resources to win. Indiana State is located in the epicenter of college basketball, we have one of the best venues in the country and they are upgrading locker rooms and corporate suites this off-season, they have doubled the NIL budget, we were a terrible product this year and still ranked 3rd in the Valley in attendance. No one has any excuse not to be a perennial top five team in this conference.
I think Indiana State putting that out into the either had more to do with putting to bed any doubt that Graves would be back and the understanding of how important revenue share they needed to communicate with the entire fan base that we have the funds to be successful.
For me, the biggest thing they did without even realizing it was take away any false narrative…
Last edited:
Become a Supporting Member to remove this ad and help support the site.
I will add I’ll take an ESB any day of the week as well. He might not be the best system fit (ala can’t shoot for shit) but his high motor, athletic ability, and will to improve is enough for me to want him in the program.
But to take from Graves getting Scott. That was a low risk high reward recruit with incredibly tight family ties to the university. If we didn’t land him alarm bells should be going off. I’m in sales, sometimes you get lay-up sales. That was a lay-up sale.
Agree with your point 100%. Love the analogy of “NIL raises your floor, recruiting raises/lowers your ceiling.” Beautiful.
Agree on ESB and we don’t typically know enough inside baseball to really know who lands who - but ESB is an Odum get. That said, you can’t just hand out flowers in recruiting JVB was also an Odum get… So he’s not batting 1,000 either.
You’ve got to hope with him having a local serious girlfriend (allegedly) it’s enough to keep him here. Because athletically he might have done enough to get paid - I don’t think it will translate for him unless he fixes that free throw % but I wouldn’t doubt he command $75-$125k in the portal this year from somewhere.
This, to me, is 100% what Nathan was doing with that interview. He is putting it all out there so there are no questions about what is expected. Graves knows he has the support of the administrations for next season, but also now knows it's crap or get off the pot time. Fans and supporters know the administration is serious about being contenders and that is huge in my opinion. That makes me feel better knowing they are willing to put forth efforts for fundraising and administrative support in a difficult time. I know there are people upset about what we spend on athletics when other factions of the university are being cut or reduced, but sometimes you have to make unpopular choices to help build your brand. Our men's basketball team has the greatest opportunity to put our university in front of the most eyes and we need to go for it. If this gets done right, we will see increased student applications, higher admissions standards, college growth and more and more community support. We had it in our grasp a couple years ago, but didn't have to right administration to keep the momentum. Hopefully we can get another shot at it with good leadership in place and see what happens.
if a guy like ESB is getting offers that high from other suitors I have no problem with ISU not trying to match. I love ESB, I want him in the program, I want him to graduate a Sycamore. But at some point your head has to take over your heart and say - “is this guy worth $xxxxxx”? For as much as I love the kid I don’t know if I could justify spending that much money when he doesn’t have an outside shot or ball handling skills.
Don’t know what the right answer is but I’m sure there 100s of players in the portal that could produce like ESB for a much lower rate.
It’s year 4 or 5 of portal and NIL madness and I still can’t wrap me head around it. What’s the right thing to do? Is it worth spending a little more to keep a known but limited player or spend less, roll the dice and try to find diamonds in the rough? Is it worth spending $600,000 a year and finishing 4-7 in the conference? I don’t envy the coaches in this landscape at all.