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if you could put together a 10 team conference that makes geographical sense what would it be? how many privates do you want in it? how many football programs do you want in it? i think that there are 4 other schools in the MVC that are in the same position we are (southern, UNI, missouri state, illinois state) those schools are all public, have football, and have competitive balance. after those 4 other schools you are looking at either inferior talent, non-football schools, private schools, geographical reaches, and or pipe dream schools like Butler or Dayton. It would be hard to pick out 10 schools in the midwest to put together a top 10 basketball conference that are all public, have football, and competitive balance. Sorry, but i don't want to play the likes of most teams in the OVC, that is not appealing at all

if i had to put together a realistic conference, this is what it would look like

1. Indiana State
2. Southern Illinois
3. Northern Iowa
4. Missouri State
5. Illinois State
^^^^^these 5 should stick together regardless
6. Wichita State (football or not, i want them in our conference to raise the profile for basketball and baseball)
7. Western Kentucky (they would be a perfect fit for the MVC if it wasn't for their FBS football)
8. Bradley (private school but great basketball tradition. now only if they were good again)
9. St. Louis (private school but it always irritates me on why they AREN'T in the MVC)
10. Belmont (private school a solid basketball program and who wouldn't want to take road trips to nashville?)


my next school up
11. Murray State (they have football, come from a great basketball state, very good basketball program)

out of those 11 schools the only school that would be a "dream" is Western Kentucky and that is because of their FBS label.
 

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treeman said:
if you could put together a 10 team conference that makes geographical sense what would it be? how many privates do you want in it? how many football programs do you want in it? i think that there are 4 other schools in the MVC that are in the same position we are (southern, UNI, missouri state, illinois state) those schools are all public, have football, and have competitive balance. after those 4 other schools you are looking at either inferior talent, non-football schools, private schools, geographical reaches, and or pipe dream schools like Butler or Dayton. It would be hard to pick out 10 schools in the midwest to put together a top 10 basketball conference that are all public, have football, and competitive balance. Sorry, but i don't want to play the likes of most teams in the OVC, that is not appealing at all

if i had to put together a realistic conference, this is what it would look like

1. Indiana State
2. Southern Illinois
3. Northern Iowa
4. Missouri State
5. Illinois State
^^^^^these 5 should stick together regardless
6. Wichita State (football or not, i want them in our conference to raise the profile for basketball and baseball)
7. Western Kentucky (they would be a perfect fit for the MVC if it wasn't for their FBS football)
8. Bradley (private school but great basketball tradition. now only if they were good again)
9. St. Louis (private school but it always irritates me on why they AREN'T in the MVC)
10. Belmont (private school a solid basketball program and who wouldn't want to take road trips to nashville?)


my next school up
11. Murray State (they have football, come from a great basketball state, very good basketball program)

out of those 11 schools the only school that would be a "dream" is Western Kentucky and that is because of their FBS label.
Click to expand...

easy for me.... In a dream... I would have Southern Illinois, IndSU, UE join the OVC - reality tells me it's really difficult to have a conference with only football schools - be nice but... another thought is Lipscomb joining the OVC if UE does, then UNK, Mercer and UTChat. Make two divisions... North/South or East/West.
So.......
Current OVC members Plus
ISU
SIU
UE
Lipscomb
UNK (bring Cinci market in)
Mercer
UTChat
& beg St. Louis
and that's too many schools... LOL Let the Missouri Valley have their West Northwest geography... and Wichita isn't a state...
I like this because of the geography and geographical rivalries.. All Tenn school games.. ISU/SIU/EIU/UE... SIUE/SIU/EIU/SEMO/St.Louis.... Mercer/Jacksonville.... Belmont/Lipscomb.... MSU/Belmont/APSU... I can go on...
Inexpensive travel I think... Geography is manageable. Nice Big City markets... Nashville, Cinci, St. Louis, Chat, Atlanta...
 
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This map is interesting (FCS schools):
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2308083/FCS_Map.png

For football (map):
http://home.comcast.net/~jma155/images/cfb/map/IAA_HelmMap.gif

So...
Indiana State
Illinois State
Eastern Illinois
UNI
Western Illinois
Southern Illinois
Remaining four ... take your pick from the schools in Tennessee and Kentucky. Maybe keep NDSU and SDSU (not ideal location wise, but they have both sports and NDSU isn't bad at basketball). I will contend that having a high profile school in basketball really doesn't serve much of an advantage to us. They're usually either private or have no football program and have a huge financial advantage as a result.
 
bent20 said:
This map is interesting (FCS schools):
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2308083/FCS_Map.png

For football (map):
http://home.comcast.net/~jma155/images/cfb/map/IAA_HelmMap.gif

So...
Indiana State
Illinois State
Eastern Illinois
UNI
Western Illinois
Southern Illinois
Remaining four ... take your pick from the schools in Tennessee and Kentucky. Maybe keep NDSU and SDSU (not ideal location wise, but they have both sports and NDSU isn't bad at basketball). I will contend that having a high profile school in basketball really doesn't serve much of an advantage to us. They're usually either private or have no football program and have a huge financial advantage as a result.
Click to expand...

B20, if we are looking for schools that make sense geographically as well as being "similar" types of institutions, i'd feel very comfortable with your list. I would always desire to see us in the same conference with ILSU and SIU because they've been with us for decades and the rivalries are already there. Same thing with EIU and WIU. UNI is a strong addition obviously but I can see them getting higher "expectations" as their star rises and they may go elsewhere.

Those that have been around SP for awhile are aware that I personally have touted for some time that I would like to see Indiana State find a way into a new-revised Mid-American Conference knowing that the MAC's "1-A" status is waning, at best, and that whatever the new MIDDLE level designation ends up in football, would be a perfect time for us to join, and hopefully along with SIU and ILSU. I still think that when all of this FBS, FCS craps plays out that my dream might become reality. If it doesn't, I really like your idea. I do not think anything will happen until the new Power 5 set up becomes permanent and the NCAA decides what to do with the REST of the collegiate football world. Then all hell breaks loose in my mind. We'll see but it is fun talking about it.
 

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southernindianaballer said:
easy for me.... In a dream... I would have Southern Illinois, IndSU, UE join the OVC - reality tells me it's really difficult to have a conference with only football schools - be nice but... another thought is Lipscomb joining the OVC if UE does, then UNK, Mercer and UTChat. Make two divisions... North/South or East/West.
So.......
Current OVC members Plus
ISU
SIU
UE
Lipscomb
UNK (bring Cinci market in)
Mercer
UTChat
& beg St. Louis
and that's too many schools... LOL Let the Missouri Valley have their West Northwest geography... and Wichita isn't a state...
I like this because of the geography and geographical rivalries.. All Tenn school games.. ISU/SIU/EIU/UE... SIUE/SIU/EIU/SEMO/St.Louis.... Mercer/Jacksonville.... Belmont/Lipscomb.... MSU/Belmont/APSU... I can go on...
Inexpensive travel I think... Geography is manageable. Nice Big City markets... Nashville, Cinci, St. Louis, Chat, Atlanta...
Click to expand...

To add... I just think the travel expenses west and northwest are pretty high and we are going to dead markets... markets that don't benefit ISU. How many students from the Dakotas will consider ISU? I think I have too many teams... it would be divided in half with 10 teams in each division and you would never meet some teams.. for a few years. But the idea is there to grasp teams on the fringe of or in big markets.... I think Murray, Belmont, ISU, Southern are pretty consistent basketball contenders and if St. Louis were there - wow. Football contenders are Eastern KY, UTChat, and we are up and coming... But I like geographic rivalries, low travel costs and big market cities. I think St. Louis would be all over a conference situation as this is outlined... Some great attendance at their games would be had and much lower travel expenses. My idea is heavier in basketball contenders than football which is kind of a benefit to us.
 
I would have InState-Ball State- Il.State- Missiour State- Northern Iowa- Ohio U- West.Mich- West Ken.- N. Dakota State.- N. Dakota U.

Dakotas because when I retire up in Minnesota I can go to a couple games!!!
 
I don't know why Ball State always comes up in discussions like these. Yes, in-state school, former rival, but they hold many advantages over us. Much bigger, better facilities.
 

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Having a horizon league team in my backyard, I have been following this closely.

Many are saying that it will be NKU, with the hope to add Belmont and Murray State later down the road. People are pretty adamant that it will not be (under any circumstances) IUPUI or IPFW, not matter how bad those schools want in.
 
Am I the only one who thinks the MVC is a potential drag on the ISU athletic financials? Could it be better? What good does it do for ISU to consistently travel to small markets in Kansas, Iowa, and the Dakotas? Don't get me wrong the MVC is a solid and good conference and I'm happy ISU is a member. But....Could ISU be tapping into Nashville, Atlanta, St. Louis markets with repeated conference games... Would that be a better situation? Not sure... These are areas (larger markets) where we could recruit quality students and athletes, right?? or wrong?? I know we have played Illinois State for years and years.... but are they a real rival? I don't think the current students know it is - if it is. I wonder how many ISU alumni live in the Dakotas, Iowa, Normal, Peoria, Carbondale... vs Nashville, Atlanta, St. Louis, all over KY, all over TN? Just curious... Could that be a way to get key alumni more involved, too??... don't know... just curious...
 
southernindianaballer said:
Am I the only one who thinks the MVC is a potential drag on the ISU athletic financials? Could it be better? What good does it do for ISU to consistently travel to small markets in Kansas, Iowa, and the Dakotas? Don't get me wrong the MVC is a solid and good conference and I'm happy ISU is a member. But....Could ISU be tapping into Nashville, Atlanta, St. Louis markets with repeated conference games... Would that be a better situation? Not sure... These are areas (larger markets) where we could recruit quality students and athletes, right?? or wrong?? I know we have played Illinois State for years and years.... but are they a real rival? I don't think the current students know it is - if it is. I wonder how many ISU alumni live in the Dakotas, Iowa, Normal, Peoria, Carbondale... vs Nashville, Atlanta, St. Louis, all over KY, all over TN? Just curious... Could that be a way to get key alumni more involved, too??... don't know... just curious...
Click to expand...

No FBS Concerns
Indiana State
Ball State
Southern Illinois
Illinois State
Northern Illinois
Northern Iowa
Missouri State
Central Michigan
Western Michigan
Eastern Michigan

FBS Concerns
Indiana State
Southern Illinois
Illinois State
Northern Iowa
Missouri State
Eastern Illinois
Western Illinois
Murray State
Eastern Kentucky
Austin Peay
 
I'll add a controversial yet simple idea...

drop football and spend those $$$ on increasing the MBB and baseball recruiting, travel, operating budgets.

It'll never happen but it makes the 'most sense.'
 
4Q_iu said:
I'll add a controversial yet simple idea...

drop football and spend those $$$ on increasing the MBB and baseball recruiting, travel, operating budgets.

It'll never happen but it makes the 'most sense.'
Click to expand...

I was wondering when someone would say this. Realistically, if we dropped football, that money would just disappear. No sport would get more money. It's a nice thought, but it's very naive, and doesn't take into account other factors.

Listen up people - nobody gets more money if we drop football. It's just not going to happen.
 

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Bluethunder said:
Having a horizon league team in my backyard, I have been following this closely.

Many are saying that it will be NKU, with the hope to add Belmont and Murray State later down the road. People are pretty adamant that it will not be (under any circumstances) IUPUI or IPFW, not matter how bad those schools want in.
Click to expand...

But the fans don't decide who gets admitted to the conference, the school presidents do, and if they want IUPUI and IPFW, then they'll add them. The fans (especially Detroit fans) didn't want Oakland, and look what happened, Oakland was admitted. I'd bet one or both of IPFW and IUPUI wind up in the HL at some point. Just makes too much sense for getting to 10-12 teams and keeping the footprint tight
 
ISUCC said:
But the fans don't decide who gets admitted to the conference, the school presidents do, and if they want IUPUI and IPFW, then they'll add them. The fans (especially Detroit fans) didn't want Oakland, and look what happened, Oakland was admitted. I'd bet one or both of IPFW and IUPUI wind up in the HL at some point. Just makes too much sense for getting to 10-12 teams and keeping the footprint tight
Click to expand...

You might be right, but if either of those two end up in the Horizon you can bet it will be due to several other schools saying no first. They may have to settle for IUPUI.
 
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